There is a school of Thought which considers that Lord Shiva was a Human being and He composed poems in Tamil.

I am looking into the legend and verify whether there is any truth in this.

This may sound ludicrous for rationalists.

The point is that I do not consider me to be super intelligent,right and correct at all times and others ,especially my ancestors were fools to believe anything,spend time and money to build huge marvelous temples.

I have , in my Life ,seen many things which defy my Logic.

They make/made sense as I grew.

Hence I do not dismiss anything offhand by sheer arrogance.

The open approach has yielded good dividends in History in that it has brought to light many truths so far hidden because self-importance and intellectual arrogance.

At the same time I do not belive or trust anything which is not supported by internal and external evidence.

The proof of my labors lies in my posts in this blog.

As to Shiva, I have noticed a lot of curious facts between Shiva in the South and the North, though they are the same.

The Avatars of Shiva in the South were not reported in the North.

Shiva as a family man with children is not as popular in the North as in the South.

Mostly the legends of Siva in the North revolve around only the marriage of Shiva with Uma, and incidents connected with it, while in the South the information is more detailed and Shiva has been portrayed as lending a helping hand to people in distress.

His avatars are different from the Avatars of Vishnu in that while Vishnu stayed in a womb Shiva is described as one who does not stay in the womb, Ayonija'; Tamil calls Him as  Unborn Eldest, ‘Pirava Yaakaip Periyon’.

Yet He appears in a Flash , helps people in distress and disappears.

Sixty four of his Avatars of this nature are recorded in Tamil literature, all in the City of Madurai.

He is reported to have married a Pandyan Princess Meenakshi in the form of Chokkanatha.

Madurai Meenakshi Amman Temple is dedicated to Meenakshi and Shiva as Chokkanatha/Sundareswara.

These sixty-four avatars have not been recorded in any north Indian legends though some of them are hinted in Puranas, especially in Linga and Bhagavatha Purana.

In one of these Avatars Lord Shiva composed a Poem in Tamil.

This is it with meaning.

This appears as the second poem in Kurunthogai, a Sangam Literature.

The author is given as Iraiyanar, a Name for Shiva.

‘

I came across a discussion in the web whether Lord Rama was worshiped during the period of Mahabharata and Lord Krishna.

With my limited knowledge of the Epics,Ramayana and Mahabharata, I verified facts.

Viswaroopa Of Vishnu.

There is no mention of anyone , let alone Krishna, worshiping Lord Rama during the Mahabharata period.

Reasons are quite a few.

1.In Indian Philosophy, Individual worship, or collective worship is not encouraged.

Nor the idol worship is allowed /mentioned in the Vedas.

However one finds the worship of Gods by performing penance was undertaken.

In the Puranas and the Epics, Ramayana and Mahabharata, The Trimurti, Brahma, Vishnu,  Shiva and Devi were worshiped in the form of penance, mainly to get material benefit, Power or Knowledge.

Indra was also worshiped in the same way.

However the practice of worshiping a Living One or a Deified One like Rama was not in practice.

In the case of Rama,many Rishis,many commoners, and even Rakshasas including Ravana knew Rama as an Avatar.

But the fervent worship in our present style we have now was not there.

Intense personal devotion to Rama by Hanuman,Sabari and a few others was in vogue.

In the same way,Rama was not worshiped during the Mahabharata period.

2.As Indian philosophy is  of the view that personal enlightenment is by  one’s efforts and action with God as a facilitator,not by God as the sole provider of Salvation,(Gnana , Karma and Raja Yoga)

(Visishtadvains , some others and those who follow Bhakthi Marga would differ with me here), worshiping for Salvation was

in theform of penance, supplemented by effort in following Dharma as prescribed in the Vedas.

I am also aware that if one has to perform good actions and be pious , God’s Benevolence is needed.

One needs the Blessings of the Lord to even think of Him.

At the same time, Indian Philosophy is equally forceful in saying that one can attain Moksha by one’s efforts alone.

This divergence of views is the speciality of Hinduism.

These points can not be argued upon as they do not fall within the purview of Logic but Experience and Intuition.

3. Yet there is no doubt  that Lord Rama was venerated during the Mahabharata times.

Lord Krishna Himself appeared in the form of Rama to Jambhavantha before marrying his daughter Jambavathi.

And we had Hanuman revealing Himself to Bhima and extolling Rama, when Bhima tried to pick up a quarrel with Hanuman.

4.Lord Rama had shown his Viswaroopa to Bharghav Rama.

Ramayana is narrated thrice in Mahabharata by Lomasa, Markandeya and Hanuman .

.Rama’s Viswaroopa.

‘”Lomasa continued, ‘Hearing this, Dasaratha’s son blazed up in wrath and said, ‘I have heard what thou hast said, and even pardoned thee. O son of Bhrigu’s race, thou art full of vanity. Through the Grandsire’s grace thou hast obtained energy that is superior to that of the Kshatriyas. And it is for this that thou insultest me. Behold me now in my native form: I give thee sight.’ Then Rama of Bhrigu’s race beheld in the body of Dasaratha’s son the Adityas with the Vasus, the Rudras, the Sadhyas with the Marutas, the Pitris, Hutasana, the stellar constellations and the planets, the Gandharvas, the Rakshasas, the Yakshas, the Rivers, the tirthas, those eternal Rishis identified with Brahma and called the Valkhilyas, the celestial Rishis, the Seas and Mountains, the Vedas with the Upanishads and Vashats and the sacrifices, the Samans in their living form, the Science of weapons, O Bharata, and the Clouds with rain and lightning, O Yudhishthira! And the illustrious Vishnu then shot that shaft. And at this the earth was filled with sounds of thunder, and burning meteors. O Bharata, began to flash through the welkin. And showers of dust and rain fell upon the surface of the earth. And whirlwinds and frightful sounds convulsed everything, and the earth herself began to quake. And shot by the hand of Rama, that shalt, confounding by its energy the other Rama, came back blazing into Rama’s hands. And Bhargava, who had thus been deprived of his senses, regaining consciousness and life, bowed unto Rama–that manifestation of Vishnu’s power. And commanded by Vishnu, he proceeded to the mountains of Mahendra.( Mahabharata , Vana Parva,Tirtha Yatra Parva , Section XCIX)

http://www.mahabharataonline.com/translation/mahabharata_03099.php

https://www.quora.com/Hindu-Mythology/Why-is-Lord-Ram-not-worshipped-during-time-of-Lord-Krishna-When-did-Ram-become-Lord-Ram

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• When Lord Rama Realized He Was ‘Brahman’
• Balarama Worships Muruga In South Visits Pandyas

Sanskrit is language, when handled by experts can do anything including conveying two stories separated by thousands of years, with totally different content.

An example of this adaptability of Sanskrit can be seen in Magha’s Sisupala Vadha, where the verses form a Wheel!

The Link to this Post is given at the close of this Post.

There are Sanskrit slokas which convey both the Stories of Rama and Krishna in a Single verse, in A Palindrome Format.

You read straight, you get Ramayana.

Read it in the reverse order, Krishna’s Life Story.

I am providing below the  Raghava  Yadaviyam by Venkathdhvari( 17 Century)

Krishna and Rama.

‘

तं भूसुतामुक्तिमुदारहासं
वन्दे यतो भव्यभवं दयाश्रीः ।
श्रीयादवं भव्यभतोयदेवं
संहारदामुक्तिमुतासुभूतम् ॥ १॥

चिरं विरञ्चिर्न चिरं विरञ्चिः
साकारता सत्यसतारका सा ।
साकारता सत्यसतारका सा
चिरं विरञ्चिर्न चिरं विरञ्चिः ॥ २॥

तामसीत्यसति सत्यसीमता
माययाक्षमसमक्षयायमा ।
माययाक्षसमक्षयायमा
तामसीत्यसति सत्यसीमता ॥ ३॥

का तापघ्नी तारकाद्या विपापा
त्रेधा विद्या नोष्णकृत्यं निवासे ।
सेवा नित्यं कृष्णनोद्या विधात्रे
पापाविद्याकारताघ्नी पताका ॥ ४॥

श्रीरामतो मध्यमतोदि येन
धीरोऽनिशं वश्यवतीवराद्वा
द्वारावतीवश्यवशं निरोधी
नयेदितो मध्यमतोऽमरा श्रीः ॥ ५॥

कौशिके त्रितपसि क्षरव्रती
योऽददाद्ऽद्वितनयस्वमातुरम् ।
रन्तुमास्वयन तद्विदादयोऽ
तीव्ररक्षसि पतत्रिकेशिकौ ॥ ६॥

लम्बाधरोरु त्रयलम्बनासे
त्वं याहि याहि क्षरमागताज्ञा ।
ज्ञातागमा रक्ष हि याहि या त्वं
सेना बलं यत्र रुरोध बालम् ॥ ७॥

लङ्कायना नित्यगमा धवाशा
साकं तयानुन्नयमानुकारा ।
राकानुमा यन्ननु यातकंसा
शावाधमागत्य निनाय कालम् ॥ ८॥

गाधिजाध्वरवैरा ये
तेऽतीता रक्षसा मताः ।
तामसाक्षरतातीते
ये रावैरध्वजाधिगाः ॥ ९॥

तावदेव दया देवे
यागे यावदवासना ।
नासवादवया गेया
वेदे यादवदेवता ॥ १०॥

सभास्वये भग्नमनेन चापं
कीनाशतानद्धरुषा शिलाशैः ।
शैलाशिषारुद्धनताशनाकी
पञ्चानने मग्नभये स्वभासः ॥ ११॥

न वेद यामक्षरभामसीतां
का तारका विष्णुजितेऽविवादे ।
देवाविते जिष्णुविकारता का
तां सीमभारक्षमयादवेन ॥ १२॥

तीव्रगोरन्वयत्रार्यो
वैदेहीमनसो मतः ।
तमसो न महीदेवै-
र्यात्रायन्वरगोव्रती ॥ १३॥

वेद या पद्मसदनं
साधारावततार मा ।
मारता तव राधा सा
नन्द सद्मप यादवे ॥ १४॥

शैवतो हननेऽरोधी
यो देवेषु नृपोत्सवः ।
वत्सपो नृषु वेदे यो
धीरोऽनेन हतोऽवशैः ॥ १५॥

नागोपगोऽसि क्षर मे पिनाकेऽ
नायोऽजने धर्मधनेन दानम् ।
नन्दानने धर्मधने जयो ना
केनापि मे रक्षसि गोपगो नः ॥ १६॥

ततान दाम प्रमदा पदाय
नेमे रुचामस्वनसुन्दराक्षी ।
क्षीरादसुं न स्वमचारु मेने
यदाप दाम प्रमदा नतातः ॥ १७॥

तामितो मत्तसूत्रामा
शापादेष विगानताम् ।
तां नगाविषदेऽपाशा
मात्रासूत्तमतो मिता ॥ १८॥

नासावद्यापत्रपाज्ञाविनोदी
धीरोऽनुत्या सस्मितोऽद्याविगीत्या ।
त्यागी विद्यातोऽस्मि सत्त्यानुरोधी
दीनोऽविज्ञा पात्रपद्यावसाना ॥ १९॥

सम्भावितं भिक्षुरगादगारं
याताधिराप स्वनघाजवंशः ।
शवं जघान स्वपराधिताया
रङ्गादगारक्षुभितं विभासम् ॥ २०॥

तयातितारस्वनयागतं मा
लोकापवादद्वितयं पिनाके ।
केनापि यं तद्विदवाप कालो
मातङ्गयानस्वरतातियातः ॥ २१॥

शवेऽविदा चित्रकुरङ्गमाला
पञ्चावटीनर्म न रोचते वा ।
वातेऽचरो नर्मनटीव चापं
लामागरं कुत्रचिदाविवेश ॥ २२॥

नेह वा क्षिपसि पक्षिकन्धरा
मालिनी स्वमतमत्त दूयते ।
ते यदूत्तमतम स्वनीलमा-
राधकं क्षिपसि पक्षिवाहने ॥ २३॥

वनान्तयानस्वणुवेदनासु
योषामृतेऽरण्यगताविरोधी ।
धीरोऽवितागण्यरते मृषा यो
सुनादवेणुस्वनयातनां वः ॥ २४॥

किं नु तोयरसा पम्पा
न सेवा नियतेन वै ।
वैनतेयनिवासेन
पापं सारयतो नु किम् ॥ २५॥

स नतातपहा तेन
स्वं शेनाविहितागसम् ।
सङ्गताहिविनाशे स्वं
नेतेहाप ततान सः ॥ २६॥

कपितालविभागेन
योषादोऽनुनयेन  सः ।
स नये ननु दोषायो
नगे भाविलतापिकः ॥ २७॥

ते सभा प्रकपिवर्णमालिका
नाल्पकप्रसरमभ्रकल्पिता ।
ताल्पिकभ्रमरसप्रकल्पना
कालिमर्णव पिक प्रभासते ॥ २८॥

रावणेऽक्षिपतनत्रपानते
नाल्पकभ्रमणमक्रमातुरम् ।
रन्तुमाक्रमणमभ्रकल्पना
तेन पात्रनतपक्षिणे वरा ॥ २९॥

दैवे योगे सेवादानं
शङ्का नाये लङ्कायाने ।
नेयाकालं येनाकाशं
नन्दावासे गेयो वेदैः ॥ ३०॥

शङ्कावज्ञानुत्वनुज्ञावकाशं
याने नद्यामुग्रमुद्याननेया ।
याने नद्यामुग्रमुद्याननेया
शङ्कावज्ञानुत्वनुज्ञावकाशम् ॥ ३१॥

वा दिदेश द्विसीतायां
यं पाथोयनसेतवे ।
वैतसेन यथोपायं
यन्तासीद्ऽविशदे दिवा ॥ ३२॥

वायुजोऽनुमतो नेमे
सङ्ग्रामेऽरवितोऽह्नि वः ।
वह्नितो विरमे ग्रासं
मेनेऽतोऽमनुजो युवा ॥ ३३॥

क्षताय मा यत्र रघोरितायु-
रङ्कानुगानन्यवयोऽयनानि ।
निनाय यो वन्यनगानुकारं
युतारिघोरत्रयमायताक्षः ॥ ३४॥

तारके रिपुराप श्री-
रुचा दाससुतान्वितः ।
तन्वितासु सदाचारु
श्रीपुरा पुरि के रता ॥ ३५॥

लङ्का रङ्काङ्गराध्यासं
याने मेया काराव्यासे ।
सेव्या राका यामे नेया
सन्ध्यारागाकारं कालम् ॥ ३६॥

॥ इति श्रीदैवज्ञपण्डित सूर्यकवि विरचितं
विलोमाक्षररामकृष्णकाव्यं समाप्तम् ॥

Another One.

Raghava Yadaviyam
Raghava-yadaviyam by Venkatadhvari (17th cent.) is an “anuloma-viloma kavya” that narrates the story of Rama. But the Shlokas read in the reverse relate an adventure of Shri Krishna.

Ramakrishna Viloma kavyam can be found here:

Related articles

Sanskrit Poem Drwas a Wheel, Sisupala Vadha

• Ravana Abducted Rama’s Mother Kausalya. Valmiki
• Vibhishana Married Mandodari Ramayana

Anjaneya, Hanuman is considered to be an Avatar of Shiva and some Purans mention Him as the Son of Lord Shiva.

Though Hanuman was an ardent Devotee of Lord Rama, He was a devotee of Shiva as well.

But there is an incident narrated in the Valmiki Ramayana, where Hanuman uprooted the Shiva Linga!

Hanuman Worships Shiva.

Lord Rama, after the killing of Ravana, was advised to perform Prayaschitta, Atonement, for killing Ravana a Vedic scholar and a devotee of Shiva in Rameswaram, within two days from the date of killing Ravana.

Rama accordingly reached Rameswaram,while Hanuman and Jatayu were sent to search for A Shiva Linga

As they were delayed, Sita, asked by Rama , to. form a Shiva Linga out of sand , as the suspicious Muhurtha was about to end..

Sita did and at the same time Hanuman with the Linga was sighted.

Hanuman was upset that the Linga was not used by Sita .

Rama asked him to remove the Linga by the Sita so that Hanuman’s Linga could be installed,

Hanuman tried to uproot it, but finding the job tough, coiled His Tail around the Linga and uprooted it.

This fell few miles off Rameswaram and it is called Hanuman Pallam, Hanuman Pit.

In the process Hanuman’s tail was cut off.

Hanuman realized his folly and Rama advised him to perform Pooja for Shiva at Thirukkurankaval .

Hanuman did so..

‘

Lord Hanuman realized his folly. It was pre-ordained that the lingam prepared by Lord Sita was to be used for the rituals and sought forgiveness from Lord Rama and Sita to regrow his tail.

Lord Rama suggested to Lord Hanuman that he seek forgiveness from Lord Shiva instead and suggested that Lord Hanuman visit Thirukurungaval and worship Lord Shiva there to get back his tail. Hence the place has acquired its name, Tirukurunkaval (Place where Lord Shiva was worshipped by a monkey-faced God) The testimony to this story is that it is one of the few Lord Shiva temples in the world, with a shrine to Lord Hanuman facing Lord Shiva.

It is also a metaphorical message that Lord Shiva and Lord Vishnu (of which Lord Rama was an incarnation) are the same.

Thirukkurankukka/ Thirukkurankaval is one of the 275 Thevara Shivasthalam of Lord Shiva in Myladuthurai, Nagapattinam District, Tamil Nadu.  This is one of the 5 prominent temples of Lord Shiva ending its name with ‘Ka’ and they are: Thiruvanaikka, Thirukkodikka, Thirunellikka, Thirkolakka and Thirukkurankukka.

Presiding deity –  Lord Thirukunthalanathar/Kunthaleswarar /Kundalakarneswarar with his consort Goddess Sri Kunthalambikai

Mangalasasanam – Thirunavukkarasar

Theertham – Hanumath Theertham

Sthalavruksham – Mango tree

Worshipped by – Lord Anjaneya

Sannidhis – Lord Ganesha, Lord Nandikeshwara, Lord Subramanya with his consorts Goddesses Sri Valli  & Deivayanai, Lord Surya, Lord Bhairava, Idols of Anjaneya, Anjaneya, Goshtamurtham – Lord Dakshinamurthi, Goddess Sri Durga,

Festivals – Maha Shivaratri, Masi Makam, Amavasya, Chithirai Utsavam, Arudra Darisanam, Aippasi Annabhishekam, Thirukarthikai, Markazhi Utsavam

Citation.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kundala_Karaneswarar_Temple

There are numerous weapons described in the Mahabharata.

I have posted on various weapons used in the Mahabharata Battle and the Weapons of Mass Destruction(WMD).

Vishnu’s Discus.gif

These are deadly weapons and so far I have been able get information on them through the epics and other texts in Sanskrit/Tamil literature.

And of course one sees many of these weapons in Hindu Temples either as a weapon in God’s hands or as a sculpture/painting in the Prahara of a temple.

Some of these weapons were called Astras, while the others  were known as Sastras.

The Sastras are conventional weapons which can be used by anyone with proper training as one uses a Gun.

But Astras are different in that they can be used only after initiation from a Guru.

And one is expected to chant a specific Mantra.

Brahmastra, the equivalent of Hydrogen Bomb is an Astra.

There is another category of weapon which can be used both as conventional weapon and as an Astra.

This is the Chakra, (Discus)

Famous Chakra is Vishnus’ Sudharshan Chakra.

Lord Krishna also wields this.

Now a working Model of this has been found in Melarasur,near Lalgudi

The news item explains.(image below)

News on Chakram in the Indian Express. Click on the Image To Enlarge.

‘The chakram (Devanāgarī: चक्रं; Panjabi: chakkar; Malay: cakeram) is a throwing weapon from India. It is circular in shape with a sharpened outer edge and ranges in size from approximately 12–30 centimetres (4.7–11.8 in) in diameter. It is also known as chalikar^[1]‌ meaning “circle”, and was sometimes referred to in English writings as a “war-quoit”. The chakram is primarily a throwing weapon but can also be used hand-to-hand. A smaller variant called chakri was worn on the wrist. A related weapon is the chakri dang, a bamboo staff with a chakri attached at one end…

Earliest references to the chakram come from the Indian epics Mahabharata and Ramayana where the Sudarshana Chakra is the weapon of the god Vishnu. Chakradhaari (“chakram-wielder,” or simply “circle-man”) is a name for Krishna. The chakram was later used extensively by the Sikhs as recently as the days of Ranjit Singh. It came to be associated with Sikhs because of the Nihang practice of wearing chakram on their arms, around the neck and even tied in tiers on high turbans. The Portuguese chronicler Duarte Barbosa writes (c. 1516) of the chakram being used in the Delhi Sultanate.^[2]‌

The people of the kingdom … are very good fighting men and good knights, armed with many kinds of weapons; they are great bowmen, and very strong men; they have very good lances, swords, daggers, steel maces, and battle-axes, with which they fight; and they have some steel wheels,which they call chakarani, two fingers broad, sharp outside like knives, and without edge inside; and the surface of these is of the size of a small plate. And they carry seven or eight of these each, put on the left arm; and they take one and put it on the finger of the right hand, and make it spin round many times, and so they hurl it at their enemies, and if they hit anyone on the arm or leg or neck, it cuts through all. And with these they carry on much fighting, and are very dexterous with them.

From its native India, variations of the chakram spread to other Asian countries. In Tibet, Malaysia, and Indonesia, the chakram was not flat but torus-like. The Mongol cavalry used a similar throwing weapon with spiked edges.^{[citation needed]}

..

Chakram are traditionally made from steel or brass which is beaten into a circular shape against an anvil with an indentation for the curvature. Two ends are connected with a piece of brass and then heated, forming a complete circle before the brass is removed. Some chakram, even those used in combat, were ornately engraved, or inlaid with brass, silver or gold.

The chakram is half an inch to one inch wide and is typically between 5-12 inches in diameter. The smaller variations are known as chakriwhile the larger ones are called vada chakra which were as large as a shield.

Throwing Technic.

The chakram’s combat application is largely dependent on its size. Regular-sized (15+ cm dia.) steel chakram could be thrown 40–60 meters, while brass chakram, due to their better airfoil design, could be thrown in excess of 100 meters.^[4] If properly constructed, it should be a perfect circle. Warriors trained by throwing chakram at lengths of green bamboo. In single combat, the chakram could be thrown underarm like a modern Aerobie. In battle, it was usually thrown vertically so as to avoid accidentally hitting an ally on the left or right side. A stack of chakram could be quickly thrown one at a time like shuriken. On elephant or horseback, chakram could be more easily thrown than spears or arrows. Because of its aerodynamic circular shape it is not easily deflected by wind.

The most iconic method of throwing a chakram is tajani, wherein the weapon is twirled on the index finger of an upraised hand and thrown with a timed flick of the wrist. The spin is meant to add power and range to the throw, while also avoiding the risk of cutting oneself on the sharp outer edge. An adept user can twirl the chakram while using another weapon with the other hand. The use of tajani in battle was perfected by the Nihang who employed a particular formation to protect the chakram-wielder from harm. Although variants of the chakram would make their way to neighbouring parts of the region, the tajani technique appears to have remained unique to Indian martial arts.

The smaller chakri could also be worn on the arms or wrists and used like knuckledusters. When worn on the arms the chakri could be used to break or cut the opponent’s arms while grappling. The larger vada chakra were worn around the neck and thrown or dropped down on the opponent vertically. In the turban, it could be raked across an enemy’s face or eyes while fighting.

Citation.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chakram

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My Posts are an attempt to unravel our History, which has been distorted ,erased beyond imagination by the Britishers and other westerners at the instance of the Vatican and the special effort of the Britishers to Divide India and rule it, by sowing seeds of mistrust, disrespect for our scriptures.

Rameshwaram, where Rama worshiped Shiva.

This was achieved by totally erasing some of our texts,by having the ancient manuscripts shipped abroad, by introducing English as a Medium of instruction totally banishing India Languages, especially Sanskrit and by pseudo Indologists like Max Mueller,a  Missionary by initially trying to write honestly and later interpolating meanings of the Vedas that would make a mockery of Hinduism.

I am trying to piece together our History , thanks to the web, where wittingly or unwittingly the suppressed information about Santana Dharma is available.

It takes a considerable effort to locate them.

That has been the purpose of my Blog, apart from informing the younger generation about how they are inheritors of a Great Culture.

In this process some times information is likely to surface, which may not be palatable to some Hindus even.

For example the information that Vedas do not prohibit women from performing Sraddha or having Upanayana performed for them

Or there is no such thing temple worship.

Or there is no Caste by Birth.

Now I am presenting information about the Avatars of Vishnu,Rama here.

Similar information on other Avatars follows.

After the Vedic period there have been unsavoury pollution of Sanatana Dharam with many schools of Thoughts coming into force, some denying the Vedas, some denying God, but believing in the Vedas,then sects Saivism and Si Vaishnavam

The last one took an ugly turn with each accusing the other and one sect insulting Vishnu and another Shiva.

All are wrong and they do not carry the authority of the Vedas, notwithstanding what the Puranas say.

For a Hindu, the Vedas are The Authority, period,

Now to the question of whom did Lord Rama worship, one depends on Valmiki Ramayana and other Ramayana also by Valmiki.

Now Valmiki Ramayana is the one being accepted as the source.

Lord Rama belonged to Surya Vamsa, the Solar Dynasty.

As such Surya the Sun is their Deity.

That Surya is considered as the expression of Vishnu is another matter.\

However Lord Krishna says , in the Bhagavad Gita,otherwise.

He says He is Vishnu, not as the other way.

Adhityaanam aham  Vishnu and not as

Vishnunnam Aham Adhitya.

So Rama. following family Traditions, worshiped Surya.

Apart from this Rama worshiped Shiva a couple of times the important one being His Worship of Lord Shiva, at Rameswaram to rid of the Brahmahathi Dosha accrued by killing Ravana, a vedicV scholar.

Rama also worshiped Surya in the battle field for mental strength and victory, at the instance of Sage Agastya.

Thus was born the Adhitya Hrudayam Sloka.

Rama also seemed to have worshiped Devi though Valmiki does not mention this in Ramayana.

‘As per Patteeshwaram Ashtabhuja Durga Temple stala, it is noted that the worship of Devi Durga owes its origin to ShreeRam. In the ‘Ramayana’, as it goes, Rama went to ‘Lanka’ to rescue his abducted wife, Sita, from the grip of Ravana, the king of the Demons in Lanka. Before starting for his battle with Ravana, Rama wanted the blessings of Devi Durga . He came to know that the Goddess would be pleased only if she is worshipped with one hundred ‘NeelKamal’ or blue lotuses. Rama, after travelling the whole world, could gather only ninety nine of them. He finally decided to offer one of his eyes, which resembled blue lotuses. Durga, being pleased with the devotion of Rama, appeared before him and blessed him…

..he correctness of Ramayana is that the story is based on the Ramayana, but does not actually come in the Ramayana text of Valmiki. It is found in various Puranas. When Rama was going to cross the ocean, some texts describe that He performed worship of Durga Devi to inform her of His intentions of invading Lanka. The reason for this is that Durga was the protector of Kuvera’s island of Lanka before it was taken by Ravana. As such, it was proper etiquette for Rama, acting as a human king, to inform Durga Devi that He was about to invade her area of control. In this story, Rama acts as a yajaman, and Brahma acts as a priest who performs the sacrifice to please Durga Devi.

In the sattvika puranas, the story is described that Rama prays to Durga, and Durga replies, “I am your external shadow energy. What ever you wish to do, I am your servant.” This is along the lines of the text “shrishti-sthiti-pralaya-sadhana-shaktir eka chayeva yasya bhuvanani bibharti durga” found in the scriptures. Durga Devi (Maha Maya) is the shadow energy of Lord Narayana.

In the rajasika puranas the story is described differently. When Rama calls to Durga, she refuses to appear. Then Rama pierces his eye with an arrow, and Durga Devi appears crying tears of blood.

Throughout the Puranas and various versions of the Ramayana we find a variation of three types of puja Rama did, either to Shiva, Durga or Brahma. It is likely that the variations are due to yuga-bheda, or the minor differences that occur in different ages. The Rama-lila is performed every Treta-yuga, and as such it has occurred thousands of times with many variations. We do not know from which time period the stories are recorded in each book. Thus there are many seemingly contradictory descriptions in the Puranas. It is described that Jambavan, the vanara devotee of Lord Rama, takes part in each incarnation of Rama in the same body. The cosmic cycles of time are moving like seasons, and these histories are played out in every age on schedule.
http://www.bvashram.org/articles/48/1/Di…

Finally, depending on Valmiki Ramayana, the sage Agastiya suggested Rama is found correct and nowhere it is found Durga worship by Rama. Only sage Agastiya adviced Rama to conquer in the battle field by worshipping the Surya, the sun-god rendering Aditya Hridayam. Rama accepted the sage Agastiya’s advice and worshipped.’

I have posted quite a few posts where Rama is shown to have worshiped Shiva many times.

And his ancestor Bhagiratha brought Ganges to Earth by severe peneance to Lord Shiva.

Based on these texts, Lord Rama worshiped Shiva and Surya.

Citation.

https://in.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20110509025104AAULkKN

Bhagiratha Worships Shiva, Stuthi.

https://in.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20110509025104AAULkKN

PS.Let me add that Shiva and Vishnu are expressions of the Same Reality Brahman and there is no question of who is Greater.

Though comments are welcome, no comment about sectarian issues will be published.

This site is meant for Sanatana Dharam, the underlying principle being,

All Gods are One, May Every One Be Happy.

Sarvam Krishnaarppanam.

Everything Is Dedicated to Krishna.

Maatha Ca Parvati Devi Pitha Devo Maheswaraha,

Baandhavaa siva Bhalthaascha Swadeso Bhvanathrayam

My Mother is Parvati,

Father, Shiva.

Devotees of Shiva are my relatives and

All the three worlds are Mine

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One is born from a woman, ends up in Earth.

Hinduism accords the respect these deserve.

A woman is called Gruha Lakshmi, one who brings Prosperity to Home.

Tamil calls her Illal, one who owns/rules the Home.

Lord Balaji In Garbha Graha, Tirupati.

Similarly Earth is given the respect it deserves for it supports from Birth to Death.

Earth is eulogized as Mother and there are Vedic Sukthas in praise of the Earth, Bho Suktham.

There is Neela Suktham, Neela is considered to be the consort of Lord Vishnu.

Such being the case, there is no wonder in Hinduism calling the Sanctum Sanctorum of a Temple as Garbha Gruha, Gharbha meaning The Womb and Gruha, the Home.

Tamil calls The Gharbhagriha as Karuvarai, meaning ‘where the Foetus stays’

One’s first Home is the womb.

‘

A Hindu temple consists of an inner sanctum, thegarbha griha or womb-chamber, where the primary idol or deity is housed along with Purusa. The garbhagriha is crowned by a tower-like Shikhara, also called the Vimana. The architecture includes an ambulatory for parikrama(circumambulation), a congregation hall, and sometimes an antechamber and porch.

The Hindu temple architecture reflects a synthesis of arts, the ideals of dharma, beliefs, values and the way of life cherished under Hinduism. It is a link between man, deities, and the Universal Purusa in a sacred space.

In ancient Indian texts, a temple is a place for Tirtha – pilgrimage.It is a sacred site whose ambience and design attempts to symbolically condense the ideal tenets of Hindu way of life. All the cosmic elements that create and celebrate life in Hindu pantheon, are present in a Hindu temple – from fire to water, from images of nature to deities, from the feminine to the masculine, from kama to artha, from the fleeting sounds and incense smells to Purusha – the eternal nothingness yet universality – is part of a Hindu temple architecture.

….

Garbhagriha or Garbha gruha (garbha gṛha) (Sanskrit: गर्भगॄह) is the sanctum sanctorum, the innermost sanctum of a Hindu templewhere resides the murti (idol or icon) of the primary deity of the temple. Literally the word means “womb chamber”, from the Sanskritwords garbha for womb and griha for house. Only ‘priests’ (pujari) are allowed to enter this chamber.

Although the term is often associated with Hindu temples, it is also found in Jain and Buddhist temples…

In temples with a spire or vimana, this chamber is placed directly underneath it, and the two of them form the main vertical axis of the temple. These together may be understood to represent the axis of the world through Mount Meru. The garbha griham is usually also on the main horizontal axis of the temple which generally is an east-west axis. In those temples where there is also a cross-axis, the garbha gṛha is generally at their intersection.

Generally the garbhagriha is a windowless and sparsely lit chamber, intentionally created thus to focus the devotee’s mind on the tangible form of the divine within it. Entrance to the garbha grha may be restricted to priests who perform the services there…

In the Dravida style, the garbhagriha took the form of a miniature vimana with other features exclusive to southern Indian temple architecture such as the inner wall together with the outer wall creating a pradakshina around the garbhagriha. The entrance is highly decorated. The inner garbhagriha or shrine became a separate structure, more elaborately adorned over time.

More often garbhagriha is square and sits on a plinth, its location calculated to be a point of total equilibrium and harmony as it is representative of a microcosm of the Universe. In the centre is placed the image of the deity.

But sometimes, for the temples of feminine deities, the garbagriha is rectangular. For example in the temple of Varahi Deula in Chaurasi.

The present structure of most of these temples is a two-storeyed vimana with a square garbhagriha and a surrounding circumambulatory path, an ardha-mandapa and a narrower maha-mandapa.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Garbhagriha

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hindu_temple_architecture

Natarja ,  Chidambaram Plan Image Credit.  http://natarjatemplechidambaram.blogspot.in/

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There was a comment for my Post Hanuman sheds Tears, Real Life Story in Facebook that the Idol of Lord Hanuman at Banswadi, a suburb of Bangalore sheds tears on Hanuman Jayanthi Day.

I sought information from the writer.

Hanuman, Banswadi, Bangalore.

No sooner than I posted the reply, I realised that I could Google for the information.

I did just that.

For the web search term ‘hanuman tears banaswadi’, I could get information.

This included the one from Bangalore Tourism .

I am providing the excerpt from the site.

But for Video search, the search returned with the only Video.

The catch is that the Video has been blocked by the Government Of India!

This is the search result.

https://www.google.co.in/search?q=hanuman+tears+banaswadi&espv=2&biw=1366&bih=643&tbm=vid&source=lnms&sa=X&ved=0CAkQ_AUoA2oVChMI0ZeG_8LnxgIVTgiOCh3kPA5h&dpr=1

This is the message for the Url..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DVDbg8ZNtDA

Well, what reason could there be?

That It is Hanuman, ?

Hanuman Sheds Tears, Banswadi , Bangalore.

‘Every year on the eve of Hanuman Jayanthi which falls between December 16 to January 14 usually on a full moon-day in the month of Chaitra, this deity is attracted by a miracle; it so happens that tears come out from the idol and people flock from all parts of Bangalore to witness this miracle.

The Most important prehistory of this temple was constructed in dravidian fashion, it is 100 years old. and it has small small temples to denote their prehistory themselves and dedicated to Lord Rama, Shiva and Ganapathi within the walled compound.

 http://www.bangaloretourism.org/bangalore-Banaswadi-Hanuman-Temple.php

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The History of Lord Shiva and Subrahmanya are so complex and intricate with various cross references in The Vedas,Puranas, Ramayana , Mahabharata and Ancient Tamil that it needs a careful study to reconstruct history.

Though Tamil mentions the Sanatana Texts , the Puranas and the Ithihasas, there seems to be a special niche for Shiva and Subrahmanya, giving rise to the speculation that these two personalities might belong to pre Sanatana Dharma period.

It might be of interest to note that Shiva is not directly mentioned in the Vedas, but in Sri Rudra, while Subramanya is referred to as Skanda.

No individual Hymns were addressed to them as addressed to Narayana, Vishnu, Lakshmi, Durga, Ganesha and the others, though these Deities were worshiped by Rama and Krishna.

I am doing research on this and shall come up with a series of articles.

Subrahmanya worship is ver old in the South and the oldest Subrahmanya Temple dated around 4 BC has been found near Pondicherry.

Please refer my Post on this.

And the presence of Siddhas is a mystery in Hinduism as Shiva is described as the Adi, First Siddha, followed by Agastya and Bhogar.

There is a controversy as to who was the chief disciple of Lord Shiva for Yoga, Bhogar or Agastya.

Agastya has been dated 5000 years ago.

Check my Post.

As to Bhogar, He is also as old as Agastya if we are to take the Siddha manuscripts into account.

I am looking into this.

Subrahmanya one of the chief deities of Tamil Diaspora ruling the mountainous region called Kurinji is reported to be one of the Gurus of Bhogar.

Bhogar had installed the Idol of Lord Subrahmanya at Palani in Tamil Nadu .

This Idol was made of Nava Paashaana,not stone, but of a special mixture of herbs that has with stood the test of Time for over two thousand years!

There are reports that more ancient Temple of Subrahmanya is in Odhimalai, near Coimbatore.

This temple is in a place called irumborai.Irumborai is situated at a distance of 10 kms from puliyampatti which is on the way of Coimbatore to Sathiamangalam at 48 th km.

This was established by Bhogar, the Siddha.

The temple has Subrahmnaya with five faces and eight hands and is considered as Shiva.

The Murthy is called Krauncha Vedamurthy, the epithet applies to Subrahmanya/Shiva.

Another speciality is that there is no Sanctum for Devi!

As Prasad, the sand from the place considered to be the remains of the Homa Kunda Fire raised by Bhogar.

(Please refer my Post Shiva’s Marriage Fire still Burning)

This temple is in Odhimalai.

Odhi in Tamil means repetition of sacred mantra.

Legend.

During a visit to Mount Kailash, Lord Brahamma, the creator, after saluting Vinayaka, simply bypassed Muruga and proceeded for darshan of Lord Shiva.  Lord Muruga stopped him and demanded the meaning of the Pranava Mantra from Brahmma which Brahamma was not able to offer.  Hence, Muruga jailed him and began the creation work Himself.

Brahmma had five faces then.  Lord Muruga too, having assumed the charge of creation had for himself the same five faces.  All the creatures created by Lord Muruga including humans, were of high righteous standards and enjoyed high longevity too.  This added to the burden of Mother Earth.  She went to Lord Shiva and explained her woes.  Lord Shiva intervened, asked Muruga the meaning of Pranava Mantra which Lord Muruga explained.  On the direction of Lord Shiva, Muruga released Brahmma from his captivity.

Lord Muruga explained the meaning of  Pranava (the first Vedic sound Ohm) in Swamimalai.  Here in Irumbarai, Muruga taught the Agamas of the Vedas.  Odhal in Tamil means learning.  Malai means hill.  As Lord Shiva learnt from His son Muruga these philosophies here, the place came to be known as Odhimalai.  The Lord also was named Odhimalai Andavar.

Ygnya Bhomi where Bhogar Performed the Oblation.

‘1) Muruga stands with 5 faces and 8 hands and the Peacock has its face towards Lord’s left leg.
2) Five faces are Eesahanyam, Thatpurusham, Aghoram, Vamadevam, and Sathyojadham.
3) In case, there was no peacock in the vighraham, we can say, this is Lord Shiva himself!
4) Peacock is towards Lord’s left, which means, its Indra-mayil (Lord Indra as vahanam). Generally, in most of the temples, Peacock faces Muruga’s Right, which means they have come after Soora Samharam. This establishes this sthalam before Soora vadham, and in timeframe, before Tiruchendhur.
5) Even today, Gurukkal stands on behalf of Indra and does pooja.
6) Siddhar Bogar has done an Yagna in the North-East corner (Eesanya baagam) of this hill and sought permission from Muruga to do the Nava paashana vigraham. Muruga gave him his blessings here, and from here Bogar went to Palani, to create and install the vigraham. The sand in this place is white, compared to red ones surrounding it. During festival times, this is given as prasadham to devotees, who come up the hill.

7) Just like we send-off our guests, Lord Muruga went to Kumarapalayam, with Bogar, to bid farewell. He went with a single face and four hands. This is often misunderstood as, Muruga went to show way to Palani, since Bogar didn’t know it.
8) Bogar created a Navapashana idol in Palani, made pradhishta of it facing west, and created his Jeeva samadhi in Palani hills, close to Muruga’s abode.
9) In the whole world, only this shrine has Muruga with 5 faces and 8 hands. This is not described in any of the Vedha, Aagama and Siddha sashtras.
10) Gurukkal Ayya’s periyappa, has visited this shrine, with his Great-grandfather when he was just 4 years old. Then, it was a cave in which Muruga was present, and to gaurd this cave, there was a Cheetah, and a Peacock, which used to lie on its top.
11) There were 5 different streams there, and they will be ever flowing. Today, I didn’t see even one.
12) In the olden days, there was a bell made of mud, and if it is rung during pooja, it used to create more sound than conventional bells !!!
13) There is no separate peedam for Lord Muruga. The whole hill is His peedam, since he stands directly on the hill here. So when you keep your legs on the first step, ideally you are stepping on Muruga Himself !
14) Since Muruga preached the meaning of Pranava to Shiva, this came to be known as “Othimalai”*
15) Mahaguru Agasthiyar has termed this hill as “Gnanamalai” in his Nadi.
16) Since puranas say Muruga preached Shiva, meaning of Pranava, in his younger days, before his Thirukalyanam, we can see Othimalai as “Moolasthanam” of Murugan.
17) This has not been sung by Naalvar and Arunagirinathar. Arunagirinathar has sanctified this as “Oothimalai” and due to affinity with these hills, the song is sung here in pooja time with pronounciation of Othimalai.
18) Kirupananda vaariyar swamigal, probably the greatest known Muruga bakhtha in recent times, never got a chance to visit this hill.
19) One bakhtha has climbed this hill for 47 days continuously, bit couldn’t see the Lord on various reasons. He was allowed inside only on the 48th day of his climb. Quite shocking !

* Swamimalai also a similar History.

Othimalai, as Agasthiyar peruman mentions, is very tall. 1800 steps are there to reach the temple. Initial 900 steps are easy to climb. To mention, there are mandapams built every 100 – 150 steps, to take rest. And there is one getting constructed in between.

How to Reach, and where to stay:

In case you are closer to Coimbatore, Take Coimbatore – Annur – Othimalai.

In case you travel from Chennai / Bangalore:
First take a bus to Sathyamangalam. KPN from Chennai, ABTx from Bangalore. Just outside Sathy bus stand, there is a lodge by name PV lodge. Very decent for refreshing yourself and starting. I didn’t have breakfast, so couldn’t refer a hotel. Take a PP bus from Sathy to Puliampatti (all coimbatore buses go here). Around 8.30 in the morning, you will have a minibus to Othimalai. I took this, and realized it as a mistake, since it reached Othimalai village by 9.45 AM. Precious morning time was lost there, else I would have climbed with more energy. Take an auto from Puliampatti bus stand, it should help you a lot.

Contact:

Karthi Iyer : 0-98430-44344

Check the Phone Number.

Asking a Boon – Varam kettal:

Once the abhishegam, alangaram and archana for all were complete, Muruga was all beautiful, thus denying a chance to anyone to pray ! So, there is a method called “Varam ketal”, where Gurukkal ayya keeps flowers on the kireedam of Lord, and asks the person to prostrate before Him, and pray his needs.

1) If it is marriage, child related troubles, family oriented, then if the flowers fall to Right side of the Lord, it will succeed.
2) Any court related matters should have the flowers falling to the left to succeed.
3) In case the flowers don’t fall down, its status-quo, or, will take time to succeed.

Agastya on Odhimalai.

MahaGuru Agasthiyar Special:

Preface:

இறையருளால் இயம்புகின்றோம் இத்தருணம்,இறை வணங்கி அறம் தொடர என்றென்றும் நலமாம்.

இடைவிடா பிரார்த்தனைகள் நலத்தை சேர்க்கும்.இதை உணர்ந்து வாழ என்றென்றும் சாந்தியோடு மகிழ்வு கிட்டும்.

By the Grace of God, shall we tell now ! For anyone, by praying Lord and continuing charity, goodness will prevail forever!

Continuous prayers will add good happenings. Living life by realizing this, will give peace and happiness !!

Othimalai Mahathmiyam:

சங்கரனுக்கு,சரவணகுகன் ஓதிய கிரி!

சங்கடப்பட்ட பல்மாந்தர்கள் தலைவிதி மாறிய கிரி!!

சபலங்கள்,சலனங்கள் விட்டு ஓடிடும் கிரி!

சிறப்பில்லா முன்வினை ஊழ்பயன் சிறப்பாக மாற்றித் தரும் கிரி!!

The hill, where Shankara was preached by Saravana Guha !

The hill, where fate of many who suffered in life, has changed !!

The hill, where unwarranted desires and unwanted disturbances, run away from a person !

The hill, where even bad karma by virtue of previous births, gets good !!

சிந்தனையில் அணுவளவும் கட்டமில்லா தன்மையை நல்கிடும் கிரி!

சிறப்போ,சிறப்பில்லையோ,பேதம் பார்க்கா வாழ்க்கையை ஏற்க வைக்கும் கிரி!!

சப்த கன்னியர்கள்,அன்னையோடு,அன்னை அருளால் அருளும் கிரி!!!

The hill, which removes even petty sufferings from thinking of mind!

Good or bad, The hill, which makes you to accept life as such, without seeing differences !!

The hill, where Saptha Kannis, together with Mother, by Mother’s grace, bless all!!!

செப்புங்கால்,

To say so,

பஞ்சமும் அடங்க,பஞ்சவதனத்தோன் அருளும் கிரி!

The hill, where the Lord of five faces, blesses you to control your five senses !

சிறப்பாக எத்தனை குன்றுகள் இளையவன் அருளால் இருந்திட்டாலும்,

குன்றுக்கெல்லாம் உயர் குன்றாய் இன்றும் சான்றாய் அருளும் கிரி!

By the Grace of younger Lord, though there are many Hillocks,
stands this, as biggest of all of them, even today as proof, and blesses !

அன்னையோடு,ஐயன் அமர்ந்து அன்றும்,இன்றும்,என்றும் அருளும் கிரி!

The hill, where with Mother, sits Father, and blesses forever !

நீறு வேறு,நாமம் வேறு என்று அறியாமையால் எண்ணும் மாந்தனுக்கு,

நீறு பூத்த அக்னிபோல் நீரோடு,நாமமும் கலந்து வேங்கடகிரியாய் அருளும் கிரி

For a person, who, due to ignorance, thinks Shaivism (Shiva) and Vaishnavism (Vishnu) are different,
The Hill, where, like simmering fire in burnt ash, with Shiva, stands Vishnu, and blesses like VenkataGiri !!!

கட்டிய கணவன் காதில் ரகசியமாய் மனையாள் ஓதினாலும்,

If, wife whispers something ill in her husband’s ears,

கட்டிய மனைவி ஒதுகிறாளே என்று தாய் ஓதினாலும்,

or seeing this, if mother preaches her son,

உபயத்தையும் தாண்டி பிள்ளைகளுக்கு எதை ஓதினாலும்,

or leaving behind these two, whatever is preached to children,

மாந்த குரு சிஷ்யனுக்கு ஓதினாலும்,

or when a human guru preaches his disciple,

அனைத்திலும் பேதமுண்டு.சுயநல நோக்குண்டு.

they all have differences, and have a selfish vision.

பேதமில்லா தாண்டிய நிலையில்,

The Hill, where, Crossing all these differences,

வேதமெல்லாம் ஓர் உருவாக,

All Vedas come together in a single form,

ஓம்கார நாத வெள்ளம் ரூபமாக,

in the flooding sea of “Om” (Pranava),

நேத்திரத்தில் கருணை வெள்ளம் பிரவாகமெடுக்க,

With the eyes having a Gracious flood,

அறுவதனமும் ஐவதனமாகி,

and with Six faces becoming five,

எழு பிறப்பும் எட்டென விரட்டி,

Driving away innumerable future births,

உபயவினையும் இல்லாது ஒழித்து,

Destroying all karmas, both good and bad,

சூல நேத்திரத்தோன் திரு மைந்தன்,

The Honored son of the Three-eyed Lord,

சதுரத்தை நவரசமாய் பிழிந்தெடுத்து,

makes nava-rasa from the four Vedas,

அதனையும் தாண்டி பல்வேறு நுட்பத்தை பேதமில்லா ஓதி,

on top of this, adding many other intricacies,

preaches to all without difference,

ஒருமுகமாய்,திருமுகமாய்,ஒரு நினைவாய் மாந்தன் வாழ அருளும் கிரி.

giving a single definition, a divine notion,
which blesses a man live with a single thought.

ஞானத்தை நல்கும் கிரி!

அஞ்ஞானத்தை அடியோடு அழிக்கும் கிரி!!

The hill, which gives Bliss!

The hill, which completely destroys ignorance!!

பேதத்தை நீக்கும் கிரி!

வேதத்தை உணர்த்தும் கிரி!!

The hill, which removes differences!

The hill, which makes a man realize Vedas!!

சீரற்ற குணங்களை சீராக்கும் கிரி!

நிலைத்த செல்வத்தை நல்கும் கிரி!!

The hill, which normalizes unwanted thoughts!

The hill, which blesses indestructible riches (its punya, not money :) ) !!

வாழ்வின் தடைகளை நீக்கும் கிரி!

எதிர்பார்த்த விடைகளை நல்கும் கிரி!!

The hill, which removes obstacles in life!

The hill, which gives expected answers!!

கர்ம நிலைகளை மாற்றும் கிரி!

அக உளைச்சல் ஒழிக்கும் கிரி!!

The hill, which changes karmic status!

The hill, which destroys mental disturbances!!

பேதம் காட்டா வேத கிரி!

ஓம் எனும் பிரணவம் ஒலிக்கும் நாத கிரி!!

The hill, which doesn’t differentiate between people, and is a Vedic structure!

The hill, where the Pranava nadha is ever sounding!!

இளையவன் திருவடி பாதம் படிந்த கிரி!

அன்னை நிரந்தரமாய் அருளும் கிரி!!

The hill, where younger Lord’s (Muruga) feet is inscribed !

The hill, where Mother permanently blesses all!!

ஐயனோடு இன்று அனைவரும் இருக்கும் கிரி!

ஓதும் கிரி அது ஓதிய கிரி!!

பேதம் தவிர்த்து பிரணவநாதம் கலந்து ஒலிக்கும் கிரி!!!

The hill, where with Father, everyone else is present today !

The preaching hills, where it was preached !!

The hill, where, leaving out all differences, Pranava nadham sounds for ALL !!!

Reading this, I was completely overwhelmed. After lots of trials, and lots of prayers to Venkata Subramaniar, who stands very tall near my home in Valasaravakkam, Chennai, I visited this temple recently. This post, is, as usual, my experiences and other related information.

Citation.

https://samiappapalanivelan.wordpress.com/tag/othimalai-andavar/

http://temple.dinamalar.com/en/new_en.php?id=51

http://othimalaiandavar.in/

Had some one informed our leaders that our current National Motto,Sayameva Jayate, Truth Alone Triumphs, is from Mundaka Upanishad, it might not have been chosen as our emblem!

Such is the attitude to our Motherland, deeply immersed we are in western thoughts.

What do our Scriptures say about Mother Land  and our duty to it?

Patriotism Quote, Rig Veda

Many, on an overdrive to honour Hinduism, quote,

‘“Janani Janma-bhoomi-scha Swargadapi Gariyasi”

Translated as “Mother and motherland are superior to Heaven.”

It is also reported that this verse appears in the Ramayana in the form of a dialogue between Rama and Lakshmana, and the quote is attributed to Rama(Yudddha Kanda)

This is incorrect.

The verse’s origin is unknown.

It may be noted that this verse is the National Motto of Nepal.

What do Vedas and the Ithihasas, Ramayana and Mahabharata say on Motherland and Patriotism!

The attitude of Sanatana Dharma to world  is,

Vasudeva Kudumbakam’

The whole world is Vasudeva’s(Krishna) Family.

Mata ca Parvati Devi Pita Devo Maheswaraha,

Baandavaa Siva Bhaktaasca,

Swadeso Bhuvana thrayam'(Shankaraccharya)

Shiva is my Father,

Parvati, my mother,

devotees of Shiva are my relatives,

The whole world, the three worlds, is Mine’

Tamil, another anient language of India says,

Yaadum oore,

Yaavarum Kelir’

Every land is mine,

Every one is my friend’

Such being the approach, one does not find any direct reference to Motherland.

For Hinduism, even thinking of anything less than the Universe is an aberration.

Every thing in the Universe belongs to every one.

Hence every one must be Happy.

All Shanthi Mantras insist on this  point.

It is not just land, but state/society is also praised as mother-goddess by the Veda. The mother says “aham rastrii” in the thirdmantra of Vaagaambhrini sukta (mandala 10, sukta 25 of Rigveda). She further says she causes wellbeing and prosperity of the peoples, all actions of men and gods are inspired by her, and she is the purpose of those actions.

Moreover, Bharatavarsha covered he entire world.

Hindus have the concept of state and society right from remote past. The concept of nation was not prevalent in the world a few centuries ago, except in Bharat. But the sense was not political/ military in nature – it was cultural and spiritual.

Actions of every individual affect the society and every change in the society affects individuals. The actions that are inspired by this awareness are beneficial to individuals as well as the society. If that awareness is lacking, then individual interests alone inspire people’s actions and individuals’ vision becomes narrow. Then, though their actions are apparently beneficial in the short run, in the long run and at a society level their consequences can be harmful. The actions of people treating society as a goddess do not suffer from such shortcomings.

We have Sukhtas devoted to Earth, Bhusuktha, and Neelasuktha.

Some Mantras.

May all our energies become one and may all the good thoughts come together and may we become the greatest amongst the mighty.

Scholars who are intelligent, valiant who are brave, and business person who donate food, if come together and have no difference of opinion then the nation shall grow.

The intelligent on the basis of their knowledge shall become mighty and great as a result of the fusion of food and energy.

Citation.

http://www.hindupedia.com/en/Concept_of_Motherland

https://ramanan50.wordpress.com/2014/05/09/rig-veda-speaks-of-daily-life-quotes/

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I am, as I have written earlier, researching into the worship of Shiva, whether He was a Pre Sanatana Dharma God a Human,,the Sanatan Dharma of the South of India predates the Sanatana Dharma, the Devi worship in the south.

In the process I have come across some information which will be of interest to Readers.

Bhogar, A Siddha worshiping Dandayuthapani at Palani.

One who reads Tamil Classics and bhakti movement, will notice that Shiva is approached with trepidation and awe, Murugan, Subrahmanya is called Muruga In Tamil, with Love, affection and worshiped as one would a child who is a Favourite, at the same time as Gnana Guru who taught Pranava to Lord Shiva.

And there are Nava Siddhas, which may correspond to the Saptha Rishis of the Sanatana Dharma.

Now to the point of Bhogar in China.

Bhoga, along with Agastya is considered to be seniors among the Siddhas.

Palani Subrahmanya Swamy Idol was installed by him with a special mixture of herbs, called Nava  Pashaana.

This Idol is expected to last through the Kali Yuga, the present aeon described by Sanatana Dharma.

‘

Kālangi Nāthar was born in Kaśi (Benares). He attained the immortal state of swarūpa samādhi at the ago of 315, and then made China the center of his teaching activities. He belonged to the ancient tradition of Nava (‘nine’) Nāth (‘lords’) sadhus (ascetics), tracing their tradition to Lord Shiva.

There are nine important shrines associated with this tradition, five of which are in the Himālaya Mountains: Amarnāth (where Shiva first taught Kriya Yoga to his Shakti partner, Parvati Devi), Kedarnāth, Badrināth (India), Kailāsanāth, (Tibet) and Paśupatināth (Nepal).

Meanwhile, Bhoganāthar practiced Kundalini Yoga in four stages. The first three stages arc described in a later chapter on “The Psychophysiology of Kriya Kundalini Pranayama”. Bhoganāthar chose the Palani Malai (mountain) in what is now southwestern Tamil Nadu as the site for intensive yogic practice (tapas) for the final stage. He attained swarūpa samādhi at Palani, through the grace of Lord Muruga, or the eternal youth, “Kumāra Swāmi”.

The Kumāraswāmi temple at Palani became the epicenter of his activities. He visited many countries astrally, and physically and through transmigration. In one of his songs Bhoganāthar claims to have flown to China at one point in a sort of airplane which he built: he held discussions with Chinese Siddhas before returning to India (Kailasapathy, 1969, p. 197-211). His visit to South America has been confirmed by accounts left by the Muycas of Chile:

“Bocha, who gave laws to Muycas, was a white, bearded man, wearing long robes, who regulated the calendar, established festivals, and vanished in time like others (other remarkable teachers who had come across the Pacific according to numerous legends of Incas, Aztecs and Mayans).” (Lal 1965, p. 20).[2]

He convened a meeting of many siddhas just before the beginning of the present Kali Yuga, in 3102 BC, to determine the best way for humanity to progress along the spiritual path during the coming period of darkness. The Yoga of love and devotion, Bhakti Yoga, was chosen as being the best means. Bhoganāthar was entrusted by the siddhas with the task of defining the rituals for the worship of their favorite deity “Palani Āndavar”, the Lord (Muruga) of Palani.

Many rituals that center around the bathing (abhishekam) of an idol of Palani Āndavar with many substances, including panchaamirtam consisting of five fruits and honey, were developed by him and continue to be followed to this day. The idol had to be created from a substance that would last throughout Kali Yuga.

The most resilient of known substances, granite, was known to wear and crack after thousands of such rituals. So Bhoganāthar fashioned it out of nine secret herbal and chemical ingredients, nava pashanam, which made it harder than granite. Eight of the ingredients were combined in a mold of the idol. The ninth, was added as a catalyst, to solidify it.

In recent times the scientists who attempted to determine the composition of a small sample of the material of the idol, were startled to find that it immediately sublimated when heated. Thus its composition remains a mystery to date. The traces of the substance are contained in the ritual offerings in which it is bathed. When these are returned and consumed by the devotee, their spiritual progress is enhanced.

A mission to China and transmigration

Kālangi Nāthar decided to enter into samādhi in seclusion for 3,000 years. He summoned Bhoganāthar telepathically from Tamil Nadu to China to take over his mission. Bhoganāthar traveled by sea, following the trade route. In China, he was instructed by Kālangi Nāthar in all aspects of the Siddha sciences. These included the preparation and use of the kaya kalpa herbal formulae to promote longevity.

After Kālangi Nāthar entered into trance, Bhoganāthar assumed his teaching mission to the Chinese. To facilitate this, he transmigrated his vital body into the physical body of a deceased Chinese man, and thereafter went by the name “Bo-Yang”. “Bo” is a derivation of the word “Bhogam” which means bliss, material and spiritual.

This bliss, for which he was named “Bo-Yang” is experienced when the Kundalini shakti, the feminine primordial yin energy awakens, passes up to the crown of the head, the seat of Shiva, the masculine yang pole, in the Sahasra cakra at the summit of the head and unites with it. The result of this integration of feminine and masculine parts of the being, or union (“Yoga”) of Shakti and Shiva, Yin and Yang,is Satchidananda: Absolute Existence-Consciousness-Bliss.

Transformation of his physical body

Bhoganāthar decided to overcome the limitations of the Chinese body, with its degenerative tendencies, and prolong its life through the use of the kaya kalpa herbs long enough for the effect of Kriya Kundalini Pranayama and related yogic techniques to bring swarūpa samādhi. In his poem Bhogar Jñāna Sutra 8, verse number 4, he describes vividly what happened after carefully preparing a tablet using thirty five different herbs:

With great care and patience I made the (kaya kalpa) tablet
and then swallowed it:
Not waiting for fools and skeptics
who would not appreciate its hidden meaning and importance.
Steadily I lived in the land of the parangis (foreigners)
For twelve thousand years, my fellow!
I lived for a long time
and fed on the vital ojas (sublimated spiritual energy)
With the ojas vindhu I received the name, Bhogar:
The body developed the golden color of the pill:
Now I am living in a world of gold

(based upon translation by Yogi S.A.A. Ramaiah, 1979, p. 40-42).

He chose three of his best disciples and his faithful dog, and took thorn to the top of a mountain. After first offering a tablet to the dog, the dog immediately fell over dead. He next offered it to his leading disciple, Yu, who also immediately fell over dead.

After offering it to the two remaining disciples, who by this time were extremely nervous, and who promptly hid their tablets rather than swallow them, Bhoganāthar swallowed the remaining tablets and also fell over unconscious. Crying with grief, the two remaining disciples went down the mountain to get material to bury the bodies. When the disciples returned to the spot where the bodies had been left lying, all that was found was a note, in Bhoganāthar’s handwriting, which said:
This kaya kalpa enabled Bhoganāthar to transform the Chinese body over a period of 12,000 years, during which time it developed a lustrous golden color. (The physiological transformation to the state of swarūpa samādhi was, however, completed only later, at Palani in the final phases of Kriya Kundalini Yoga and related practices. These phases will be described in chapter 11. Bhoganāthar’s own graphic description is recorded in the poem at the end of this chapter Initiation into Samādhi.)The kaya kalpa tablets are working.
After awakening from their trance
I restored faithful Yu and the dog.
You have missed your chance for immortality. (Ibid.)

In this poem Sutras of Wisdom — 8. he sings prophetically of the taking up of the practice of pranayama in modern times by millions of persons who would otherwise have succumbed to drug abuse:

Will chant the unifying verse of the Vedanta.
Glory to the holy feet of Uma (the Divine Mother of the Universe. Shakti),
Will instruct you in the knowledge of the sciences, ranging from hypnotism to alchemy (kaya kalpa).
Without the need for pills or tablets, the great scientific art of pranayama breathing, will be taught and recognized
By millions of common people and chaste young women.
Verse no. I (based upon translation by Yogi S.A.A. Ramaiah, 1982, p. 40).

Becomes known as Lao-Tzu, founder of Taoism

After this incident with the Chinese disciples, Bo-Yang became also known as Lao-Tzu, and was accessible for nearly 200 years, and trained hundreds of Chinese disciples in Tantric Yoga practices, wherein semen and sexual energies are conserved and sublimated into spiritual energies. The advanced techniques which he taught involve raising the energies from the mūladhāra cakra corresponding to the perineum up to the sahasraracakra during sexual intercourse with a spiritually minded partner, resulting in sublimated energy, tejas. manifesting throughout all the cells of the body. In the fifth century B.C., Confucius met Lao-Tzu Bo-Yang and afterwards said of him:

I know a bird can fly, a fish can swim, and an animal can run. For that which runs, a net can be fashioned; for that which swims, a line can be strung. But the ascent of a Dragon on the wind into heaven is something which is beyond my knowledge. Today I have met Lao-Tzu, who is perhaps like a Dragon. Among the Chinese, particularly, the Taoists, the Dragon is the symbol of Kundalini Shakti, the primordial force.

Citation.

http://palani.org/bhogar-biography.htm

In Hinduism, a siddha is “one who is accomplished”. It refers to perfected masters who have achieved a high degree of physical as well as spiritual perfection or enlightenment. Siddha may also refer to one who has attained a siddhi, paranormal capabilities.

List of Siddhas’ Samadhis, Resting Places.

The eighteen siddhas.

Citation.

http://asksolutionmdu.blogspot.in/2012/07/blog-post_19.html

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The world of Siddhars is unique and their thought run parallel to Sanatana Dharma, if one were to go by their works.

Many thoughts found in their works are reflected in the Sanatana Dharma.

This could be because of the fact that we were fed the concocted History of India, where Tamil is portrayed as anti Sanatana Dharma,inimical to North.

Hence with this background one tends to think Tamil System of Tought is different from the Sanatana Dharma.

But my researches for the past six years show that  this is not so.

One finds the echo in the other.

The problem is which preceded.

This seems difficult to fathom as the time frames are quite vast, running into thousands of years,

This BC, AD business has no relevance in Indian Thoughts because of its antiquity.

The Siddhas are realized souls who transcend Time and Space and they are believed and in many cased have been sen in Physical frame.

To cite a few, Babaji of Himalayas.Trilinga Swamigal, Kuzhandaianada Swamigal and many more from both he south and north of Vindhyas.

While the worship of Shiva has not been  mentioned in the Vedas, the Tamils swear by it  from their fist Grammar book, Tholkaappiyam.

Shiva is credited with the Creation of the Tamil language, with His son Lord Subrahmanya as his successor.

And Sage Agstya was entrusted with the job of nurturing Tamil.

Agastya is considered to be one of the early co-founders of Tamil, if the term could be used.

Agastya composed the first Tamil Grammar work called Agathiyam.

Agastya is a Siddha.

Bhogar, is the disciple of Agastya.

Bhogar installed the Idol of Lord Subrahmanya at Palani,Tamil Nadu with Nine poisonous herbs and this Idol is being worshiped even now and it is expected to last this Kaliyga, the prest aeon.

Bhogar was also a Yogin as the other other Siddhars..

He indulged in Astral Traveling, can use Transmigration at Will.

He is recorded to have been to Chile in South America.

This has been cited in their legends.(?)

Bhogar was also reported to have designed Aircraft for Traveling and used it.

I had written articles on the connection between the Tamil and the Aztecs,Mayas .

Kindly refer these Posts to have more information.

Bhogar, traversing the sky, observes faraway places like Arabia, Rome, and China.Bhogar a Senior Siddha surveying far away places.

‘

In one of his songs Bhoganāthar claims to have flown to China at one point in a sort of airplane which he built: he held discussions with Chinese Siddhas before returning to India (Kailasapathy, 1969, p. 197-211). His visit to South America has been confirmed by accounts left by the Muycas of Chile:

“Bocha, who gave laws to Muycas, was a white, bearded man, wearing long robes, who regulated the calendar, established festivals, and vanished in time like others (other remarkable teachers who had come across the Pacific according to numerous legends of Incas, Aztecs and Mayans).” (Lal 1965, p. 20)Citaitons.Material in this chapter is based upon the life story of the Siddha Bhoganāthar narrated by Yogi S.A.A. Ramaiah in his introduction to the third volume of the collected works of Bhoganathar, Bogar Kandam Yogam: Babaji’s Yoga of Boganathar, and notes in lectures.

Authorities quoted by Bancroft in the Pacific States, Vol. V., 23-24.

See ‘The Wandering Taoist’, by Deng Ming-Dao. 1983 for a contemporary account of Taoist immortals and their practices in China, and ‘The Tao and Chinese Culture’ by Da Liu. 1979 for a description of the highest goal of Taoist practices, ‘golden” immortality.

It is here that Macchamuni (Macchendranātha), one of his disciples, later composed the first great treatise on the scientific art of Kriya Tantra Yoga, from which arose the Kalpia and Kapalika tantric traditions.

Babaji and the 18 Siddha Kriya Yoga Tradition, by M. Govindan (Kriya Yoga Publications, 1991), pp. 113-118.

More on Bhogar and Siddhars to follow.

Citations.

http://palani.org/bhogar-biography.htm

From Google scholar.

http://www.energyenhancement.org/Tamil-Siddar-BHOGAR-Kundalini-Yoga-and-Spiritual-Alchemy.htm

Related.

The Incas celebrated the Makara Sanakrathi.

‘

The Ayar-Incas that primitive Aryan words and people came to America especially from Indo-Arya by the island chains ofPolynesia. The very name of the boat in Mexico is a South Indian (Tamil) word: Catamaran.”-

https://ramanan50.wordpress.com/2015/02/01/incas-of-peru-ancestors-tamils-celebrate-makara-sankaranti/

‘

‘Most of you in India are familiar with the Charak Puja ceremonial observed in Bengal and several States in South India. This Hindu Ceremonial also observed in Mexicohistorian call it the mexicon and peru. The Spanish Valador ritual. A relief of Bayon central temple of Angkor Thom inCambodia represents a rite similar to the Mexico Valador. The use of parasol (Chhatra) is an age-old sign of royalty and rank in India, Burma, China and Japan. The Maya Astec and the Incas also used it as a sign of royalty. Frescoes of Chak Multum in Yucatan show two types of parasols both of which correspond to types still in use in South-East Asia.’

Incas celebrated it as “Inti Raymi”

https://ramanan50.wordpress.com/2015/06/09/indra-in-incas-peru-viracocha-ramayana-upanishad/

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When the self-styled rationalists call every thing Hinduism stands for and Hindu sages as non sense and irrational , it is befitting to recall the words of Sir Isaac Newton, considered to be one of Giants of Physics.

Palani Dhandayuthapani , Moolavar,Palani.

‘ Sir Isaac Newton modestly remarked. “All that I have done to the human community is to make a common man understand His observable laws”. He added further by saying. “God created the forces of gravity. I connect this by a mathematical equation in an understandable way”.

How true these words are!

Palani Subrahmanaya, called as Palani Andavar, Palani Dhandayuthapani, Idol is believed to have been made and installed by Bhogar a senior Siddha.

He prepared the Idol, according to some traditions with a strange mixture called Nava Paashana.(Nine Poisonous Minerals)

This , the traditions say,was prepared by mixing minerals in a specific  proportion/combination.

Bhogar was also an Alchemist.

Paashaana also means Poison.

This mixture could have been prepared by mixing Nine rare herbs of poisonous nature .

The resultant mixture was used by Bhogar to make the Idol.

( It is believed that Bhogar made three idols, one is now at Palani, the other two have been hidden by Bhogar somewhere in the eastern Ghats in South India: they are expected to surface at an appropriate time).

The other option for the Idol’s raw material is granite.

It has been observed that the Dhandayudhapani Idol at Palani became weak below the neck and the lower portions looked as if they would fall at any time.

A suggestion was mooted to repair or change the Idol.

This was not agreeable to the devotees as it would be against the Shastras.

So the Government of Tamil Nadu appointed a committee to study the issue and submit its recommendations.

I am providing the report afer a few sentences about the findings of the committee.

1.The Idol’s face was fresh as though it was installed recently.

2.The lower portions were damaged.

3.On testing with an Atomic Analyser, i was found that the Idols was made of neither Granite, nor minerals.

4.The Sceintists were unable to determine what it is made of.

Now an abstract of the report; the web site Link is provided towards the close of the Post.

Dhandayuthapani Temple,Palani.

”

Though the preliminary visual examination of the idol revealed the possibility of the material being of granitic origin. It could not be confirmed, as neither a microscopic examination nor a chemical analysis could be done in the absence of loose material from the idol being available for such detailed investigation. But we were aware that the abhishekam materials flowing over the idol could possibly absorb some of the ingredients from the idol to acquire the medicinal property, curative qualities and offer relief to many devotees from their ailments.

Guided by this knowledge and taking a clue from this, we applied sandalwood paste to the idol and let it remain overnight. The next day the sandalwood paste was collected and a solution was prepared for further chemical examination, using
As the next step, the sandal wood paste solution from the paste left on the idol overnight was subjected to the experiment. The instrument showed no apparent reading. The experiment was repeated several times and the instrument showed a zero absorption. When other samples were tested, the instrument showed positive results but for the sandal wood paste left overnight on the idol of the lord, the result was zero absorption. It was revealed to us as a stupendous moral – that even modern scientific analysis cannot penetrate the Divine Structure.a sophisticated instrument, the Perkin-Elmer 707 atomic absorption spectrophotometer to identify the trace elements. A standard solution required for the experiment was made to calibrate the instrument.’

The Study was by Dr. Prof. M.S. Saravanan, M.Sc., Ph.D., F.M.S., F.G.S. is an an earth scientist and mineralogist and former Director of the Tamil Nadu Department of Geology & Mines and Chairman of Tamilnadu Minerals Limited and a one-time close associate of Kripananda Variar.

He was also a sub-committe member constituted by the Government of Tamil Nadu to Study and Test the Idol.

Citation.

http://palani.org/saravanan.htm

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Palani Dhandayuthapani is our Family Deity.

Some years back, when I went to Palani, I was asked by a stranger in the Temple the directions to visit Bhogar Shrine in the complex.

Though I have been visiting the Palani Temple ,I never knew that there was a Shrine for Bhogar.

I asked the Priests for directions and went to the Shrine.

I was reciting,if I recall correctly the Durga Suktha,when the priest at the Bhogar Shrine asked me to have a look at an Idol of Rajarajeswari worshiped by Bhogar.

He gave me the Idol in a Velvet cloth and it was very beautiful.

I had darshan and left with no further thought on the subject.

This was about 30 years ago.

Though I know some thing Siddhas, I did not know much till recently.

I have been, for the past few days, trying to find information on the Devi and Bhogar worship.

Only today I have been able to get some information on this.

It seems that there is an opening at the top of the Sivagiri(Palani), with a cavern underneath it and Bhogar is reported to have worshiped Devi there, with Pulipani as his Guard.

Read on.

‘

At the top of Palani Hill, near the holy Murugan which Bhogar had crafted from nine poisonous substances, there is an opening in the Earth; it is a hole in the ground; the mouth of a cave which lies below. Bhogar often lowered himself into the Earth, sat in the cave, accessing Life’s hidden secrets. He performed great austerities there, the magnitude of which very few in this modern age can fathom.

There at the opening Bhogar erected a humble shrine to the Great Mother: a few yantras, a couple of five-metal icons baring the form of the Mother and her son Murugan. He worshipped a small emerald lingam there, about ten inches in height. His one and only disciple, Pulipani (perhaps the only one who truly understood the sage), kept him company at the entrance to the underground cavern on the top of Palani Hill.

When Bhogar felt that his outer work was done, he entered the gateway of earth and stone and sat down in the darkness of the cave. Faithful Pulipani heaved a stone slab over the entrance, sealing Bhogar forever in the blackness of his earthen womb.

For thirteen generations Pulipani’s descendants have watched over that stone slab that marks the gateway to the underground chamber. Long ago, Bhogar’s little shrine was set atop that hallowed spot, and even today, is still worshipped by the vigilant sons of the faithful Pulipani. They say that Bhogar is seated quietly in meditation even now; alone in the darkness; watching the slow passage of time.

His breath is still. His mind is quiet, his heart unwavering; but through the dense dark matter of his earthly form stabs the vibrant & relentless flame of the Kundalini Shakti. There he waits…

‘At the top of Palani Hill, near the holy Murugan which Bhogar had crafted from nine poisonous substances, there is an opening in the Earth; it is a hole in the ground; the mouth of a cave which lies below. Bhogar often lowered himself into the Earth, sat in the cave, accessing Life’s hidden secrets. He performed great austerities there, the magnitude of which very few in this modern age can fathom.

There at the opening Bhogar erected a humble shrine to the Great Mother: a few yantras, a couple of five-metal icons baring the form of the Mother and her son Murugan. He worshipped a small emerald lingam there, about ten inches in height. His one and only disciple, Pulipani (perhaps the only one who truly understood the sage), kept him company at the entrance to the underground cavern on the top of Palani Hill.

When Bhogar felt that his outer work was done, he entered the gateway of earth and stone and sat down in the darkness of the cave. Faithful Pulipani heaved a stone slab over the entrance, sealing Bhogar forever in the blackness of his earthen womb.

For thirteen generations Pulipani’s descendants have watched over that stone slab that marks the gateway to the underground chamber. Long ago, Bhogar’s little shrine was set atop that hallowed spot, and even today, is still worshipped by the vigilant sons of the faithful Pulipani. They say that Bhogar is seated quietly in meditation even now; alone in the darkness; watching the slow passage of time.

His breath is still. His mind is quiet, his heart unwavering; but through the dense dark matter of his earthly form stabs the vibrant & relentless flame of the Kundalini Shakti. There he waits…

Courtesy: Forward to Shaking the Tree: Kundalini Yoga, Spiritual Alchemy, & the Mysteries of the Breath in Bhogar’s 7000 English rendering by Layne Little

http://www.alchemywebsite.com/bhogar1.html

The general information about the Siddhas are very limited.

Even here, there is a misconception that the Siddhas are Tamils and their presence is limited to Tamil  Nadu.

When Siddhas can transcend Time and Space, a Country is nothing for them.

There are Siddha sites in Karnataka, that too near Bangalore.

Siddhara Betta, Siddhas’ Hills, near Bangalore

There are prehistoric sites.

On one of the hills surrounding Siddhaloka is a massive pattern (about 30 metres, or 90 feet high) etched naturally on the rocks. If you observe carefully, it appears as a picture of the goddess Durga or Shakti, mounted on a lion, crown on head, arm raised with sword in hand.

‘

Siddhaloka is described as the world inhabited by Siddhas, the Perfected Ones. An Ashram (hermitage) of this name is situated about 40 km from Bangalore in Southern India. This is the seat of the Siddha Yoga Dham, a registered charitable institution whose spiritual head is Param Poojya (His Holiness) Swami Chetanananda Saraswati, who belongs to the ancient lineage of Siddha Gurus.

Siddhaloka is a place full of splendour and serenity. The ashram is surrounded by hills and forests, with a breathtaking view, and is in the heart of rural Karnataka. The place is blessed by Siddhas and is an ocean of Siddha Shakti (divine power). There is no pollution of any form. One is inspired to remain indrawn and experience the natural meditative state..

The cave derives its name from the peculiar picture-script found on its walls, which have been estimated by experts to date back to prehistoric times. The script is referred to as Shankha or ‘Conch-shell’ script. The actual height of the picture shown here is about four metres…

Siddhara Betta, Siddhars Mountain.

Siddhara Betta, around 12 Kms away from Koratagere in Tumkur district,

Tumkur can be reached by Train, Buses from Bangalore.

Airport.Bangalore.

http://www.siddha-loka.org/ashram.html

http://www.divinetravel.info/2012/04/siddharbetta-hill-of-siddhas.html

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The history of Bhogar tells us that he made the Palani Dhandauthapani Idol in the Garbha Graha at a place called Thannasi

Appan Temple.

Bhogar is reported to have used Nine Minerals/Herbs/poisons to prepare the raw material for the Idol.

The term Paashaana means, Minerals, herbs, Poison.

He is reported to have made three Idols.

One has been installed at Palani garbha Gruha.

Bhogar in Nirvikalpa Samadhi .

Two Idols are reported to have been hidden by Bhogar in the Eastern Ghats and it is believed that they would surface at an appropriate moment.

The idol at Palani Garbha Gruha was found to be weak below the Neck and therefore the Abhishekams were stopped.

Now Abhishekams are performed for the Utsavar only.

The committee formed by the Government of Tamil Nadu to find out the status of the Idol found , by Atomic Test, that the material used for the construction of the Idol of Murugan is neither Granite, Nor Minerals.

Please read my Post on this, where I have provided the excerpt of the Report.

Thannasiappan Temple entrance.

‘Bogar is a Siddhar, he is considered as one of the 18 siddhars born in the world. According to epigraphical sources and his book Bogar Seven thousand his period is around 3000 B.C. Bogar born at India and visited China in search of truth of life, he gained knowledge in medicine, astrology, spritiuality, yoga etc.

Bogar anticipating that in due course of period, human beings will suffer from large number of disease. As an expert in medicine he used 4448 rare herbs and made 9 poisonous medicine, mixing these 9 poisons into one needs great knowledege and skill, to make a Master Medicine ( One medicine to cure all disease ). Thirumoolar also discuss one such Master Medicine in his book Thiru Mandiram. With the consultation of Agasthiar ( Father of Ayurvedic Medicine) and other siddhars Bogar mixed the 9 poisons ( Nava Bashanam ) and made the Master Medicine in the form of Lord Murugan which is currently worshiped at Palani Murugan temple. There is a place near Palani Hill called Thanasiappan Temple which is the place were Bogar mixed the Nava Bashanam and made  the Murugan idol.’

http://palani_murugan.tripod.com/bogar.htm

http://wikimapia.org/

The title of this Post is a Misnomer in the sense that the Siddhas do not belong to any particular Region or Language.

I had provided the title to denote the Siddhas of the north of the Vindhyas(even here there are some from the South)

Generally the name Siddha is associated with the South, more specifically Tamil.

Sidhhas from the North seem to be following Patanjali, while in the south Agastya and Bhogar.

Agastya seems to have been the first after Lord Shiva.

One fact I have noticed is that Goraknath is found as a mentor of many a Siddhas from the North.

There is a Gorakka Nathar among the Siddhas in the South.

It is referred in Tamil texts that  there are 1008 Siddhas.

Many in the North are not aware of the Siddhas of the South and the South of the North.

This Post is to point out that all Siddhas belong to the Group of Realized Souls and we are not aware of it.

Following is a List of Siddhas from the North.

Route Map of Mahavtar Babaji’s Cave.Babaji was among the first batch of disciples of Agastya with Bhogar.

Shri Adabanga nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Allama nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Aughar nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Balagundai nathji

Shri Balak nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Bhadra nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Lankanath ji.

Shri Bhagai nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Shritainathji

Shri Bhartrihari (Vichar) nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Bhuchar nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Bhartrihari nathji

Shri Bhusakai nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji.

Shri Bileshaya nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Charpat nathji.

Shri Birabank nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshnathji.

Shri Brahmanai (Brahmai) nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yoga Bhagai nathji.

Shri Chakra nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji.

Shri Chandra nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Kapilnathji.

Shri Charpat nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji.

Shri Dariya nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Guru Gorakshanathji.

Shri Daya nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji 

Shri Deva nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Govindanathji

Shri Dharma nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Dhir nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Allamanathji

Shri Dhundhakar nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Eka nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Jarnadhan nathji

Shri Gahini nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Gariba nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Balak nathji

Shri Gaurav nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Matsyendranathji

Shri Gehalla raval nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Ghora cholipa nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Gopal nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Ekanathji

Shri Gorknathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Havai nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Jambha nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji.

Shri Jnyaneshvar nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Nivritti nathji.

Shri Jvalendra nathji
Guru: Omkar Adinathji

Shri Kakachandi nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Chauranginathji

Shri Kala nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Matsyenrdanathji

Shri Kanakai nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Kanipa nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Jalandhar nathji

Shri Kapil nathji (Kapila Muni)
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Kaya nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Bhartrihari nathji

Shri Khechar nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Korant nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Pir Patannathji

Shri Ladhai nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Bhusakainathji

Shri Lanka nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Madra nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Lankanathji

Shri Mallik nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Manasai nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Bhagai nathji

Shri Manik nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Manju nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Matsyendranathji

Shri Markandeya nathji
Guru: Shri Omkar Adinathji

Shri Masta nathji
According to natha-yogis and in particular to yogis of Aai-panth, Siddha Baba Mastanath is recognized by one of last avatars of Guru Gorakshanath in the human form that could be approximately in the end of a XVIII-th century. Read more…

Shri Meru nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Gauravnathji

Shri Mina nathji
Guru: Shri Omkar Adinathji

Shri Nagarjuna nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Narada Deva nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Matsyendranathji.

Shri Naramai nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Brahmainathji

Shri Nivritti nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Gahininathji

Shri Pippal nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Ramnathji

Shri Prabhudeva nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Matsyendranathji

Shri Prakash nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Praudha nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Bhartrihari nathji

Shri Ratan nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Sahajai nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Kanakainathji

Shri Sahiroba nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Gahininathji.

Shri Sanak nathji
Guru: Shri Omkar Adinathji

Shri Sananda nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji.

Shri Sanatan nathji
Guru: Shri Omkar Adinathji

Shri Sanatkumar nathji
Guru: Shri Omkar Adinathji

Shri Sarasvatai nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Shabar nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Matsyendranathji

Shri Shringeri nathji (Gopichand nath)
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Jvalendra nathji.

Shri Shritai nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Siddhabuddha nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Dariyanathji

Shri Siddhapad nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Niranjan nathji

Shri Siddhasan nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Matsyendranathji

Shri Sukadeva nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Surananda nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Balaknathji

Shri Surat nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Tara nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Matsyendranathji

Shri Tintini nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Jalandhar nathji

Shri Vakra nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Chakra nathji

Shri Vira nathji
Guru: Shri Shambhujati Guru Gorakshanathji

Shri Virupaksha nathji
Guru: Shri Omkar Adinathji.

Shri Yajnavalkya nathji
Guru: Shri Siddha Yogi Satyanathji

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I was intrigued by the fact that the Shiva worship starts with Daksha, who is the first Human being by Brahma for each Yuga.

And Daksha Kingdom was in the North of the Vindhyas.

Daksha’s daughter married Shiva. “Painting on paper depicting ‘Virabhadra The red-hued deity is coiffed exactly like Śiva. This is an unusual rendering of Virabhadra. The face of the Ganga peeps out of the dreadlocks, while loose jatas fly around his head. On his forehead is a prominent tripundra. Side fangs protrude from his mouth and a bushy moustache grows on his upper lip. In his upper right hand is a damaru, in his upper left hand a flame, the lower right hand carries a sword and the lower left a buckler. The attributes in his upper hands are unusual, as they generally bear the bow and the arrow. He is dressed in a dhoti adorned by sashes on the sides and an angavastra is draped on his elbows. Among his ornaments is a long white garland. On his feet are toe-knob sandals. At his left stands the ram-headed Daksha, sporting tripundra marks on his forehead and arms dressed in dhoti and with the angavastra tied around his hips.” Image credit.”Virabhadra Daksha” by Unknown – http://www.britishmuseum.org/research/search_the_collection_database/search_object_details.aspx?objectid=3058344&partid=1&output=Places%2f!!%2fOR%2f!!%2f41361%2f!%2f41361-2-20%2f!%2fPainted+in+Thanjavur%2f!%2f%2f!!%2f%2f!!!%2f&orig=%2fresearch%2fsearch_the_collection_database%2fadvanced_search.aspx&currentPage=1&numpages=10. Licensed under Public Domain via Wikimedia Commons – https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Virabhadra_Daksha.jpg#/media/File:Virabhadra_Daksha.jpg’

Vishnu worship seems to have been later than that of Shiva in the South, Dravida worship.

Rama’s ancestor Satyavrata Manu migrated from the South to Ayodhya, where his son Ikshvaku founded the Ikshvaku Dynasty..

If Daksha were to be the first Human being created then how do we account for Manu?

Manu seems to pre date Daksha as,

1.Daksha came later, in the beginning of the Yuga, whereas Manu is for Manvantara.

A Manu’s lifespan is 71 Mahayugas (306,720,000 years).

‘Yuga  is the name of an epoch or era within a four age cycle. According to Hindu cosmology, life in the universe is created and destroyed once every 4.1 to 8.2 billion years,^] which is one full day and night for Brahma. The lifetime of Brahma himself believed to be 311 trillion and 40 billion years as per Hindu cosmology.’

Manus and Saptha Rishis are for every Manvantara..

One of the Saptha Rishis is Agastya.

‘The earliest list of the Seven Rishis is given by Jaiminiya Brahmana 2.218-221: Vashista, Bharadvaja, Jamadagni, Gautama, Atri,Visvamitra, and Agastya, followed by Brihadaranyaka Upanisad 2.2.6 with a slightly different list: Gautama and Bharadvāja, Viśvāmitra and Jamadagni, Vashiṣṭha and Kaśyapa, and Atri, Brighu. The late Gopatha Brāhmana 1.2.8 has Vashiṣṭa, Viśvāmitra, Jamadagni, Gautama, Bharadvāja, Gungu, Agastya, Bhrighu and Kaśyapa..’

We find Agastya in the South advising Rama in the battle field not to lose heart and chant Adhitya Hrudayam on Lord Surya to win the war against Ravana.

Then we have Lord Shiva as the Father of Tamil Language.

Of course Sanskrit is also from Shiva’s Damaru, Maheswara Sutras.(Please read m Post on this)

We find the legends of Shiva in the north from the marriage of Sati ,daughter of Daksha with Shiva.

Nothing more of Shiva is mentioned in these North Indian Legends.

Manus

‘In The Immortals of Meluha, Manu is said to be a prince from south India. His family, the Pandyas having ruled the mythical land of Sangamatamil for many generations. The decadence of the Kings incurred the wrath of the gods. A great deluge submerged the entire civilization. Manu having foreseen this escaped with his followers to the higher northern lands. Manu turned into an ascetic. Eventually Manu’s prayers pacified the gods and the water abated.

In the South Shiva worship has been in vogue much earlier as Adi Shiva, The Silent Teacher,Dakshina Murthy,First Yogi who initiated Agastya, who initiated Bhogar and Kriya Babaji.

The we have Lord Subrahmanya called as Murugan and His worship is quite old.

Though the Tamil Grammar, earliest of Tamil works assigns Varuna, Indra, Vishnu, Murugan(Subrahmanya), and Devi to each of the landmass , Kurinji,Marutham, Mullai, Neydhal and Palai, Shiva always remains in the background as the Chief.

He is called as the Ancient of the Ancients.

‘Munnai Pazhamprutkum Munnaip Pazham Porule’

He is also called Pirva Yaakaip Periyon’

That is Eldest though Unborn.

Sanskrit also calls Him as Ayonija, one who does not stay in the womb.

We have a lot of references to the South in the Puranas and Ithihasas about Tamils.

‘Srimad
Bhagavatam 11.5.38-40
kritadishu praja rajan
kalav icchanti sambhavam
kalau khalu bhavishyanti
narayana-parayanah
kvacit kvacin maha-raja
dravideshu ca bhurisah
tamraparni nadi yatra
kritamala payasvini
kaveri ca maha-punya
pratici ca maha-nadi
ye pibanti jalam tasam
manuja manujesvara
prayo bhakta bhagavati
vasudeve ‘malasayah
SYNONYMS
krita- adishu — of Satya and the
other earlier ages; prajah — the
inhabitants; rajan — O King; kalau —
in Kali-yuga; icchanti — they want;
sambhavam — birth; kalau — in Kali;
khalu — certainly; bhavishyanti —
there will be; narayana- parayanah —
devotees who dedicate their lives to
the service of Lord Narayana; kvacit
kvacit — here and there; maha-raja —
O great monarch; dravideshu — in
the provinces of South India; ca —
but; bhurisah — especially
plentifully; tamraparni — named
Tamraparni; nadi — the river; yatra —
where; kritamala — Kritamala;
payasvini — Payasvini; kaveri —
Kaveri; ca — and; maha- punya —
extremely pious; pratici — named
Pratici; ca — and; maha-nadi — the
Mahanadi; ye — those who; pibanti —
drink; jalam — the water; tasam — of
these; manujah — humans; manuja-
isvara — O lord of men (Nimi);
prayah — for the most part; bhaktah
— devotees; bhagavati — of the
Personality of Godhead; vasudeve —
Lord Vasudeva; amala- asayah —
having spotless hearts.
TRANSLATION
My dear King, the inhabitants of
Satya-yuga and other ages eagerly
desire to take birth in this age of
Kali, since in this age there will be
many devotees of the Supreme Lord,
Narayana. These devotees will
appear in various places but will be
especially numerous in South India.
O master of men, in the age of Kali
those persons who drink the waters
of the holy rivers of Dravida-desa,
such as the Tamraparni, Krtamala,
Payasvini, the extremely pious Kaveri
and the Pratici Mahanadi, will
almost all be purehearted devotees(
of the Supreme Personality of
Godhead, Vasudeva.(http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alvars)

..

ाः तस्याम्
दिशि सुदुर्गमाः |
कपीइशः कपि मुख्यानाम् स तेषाम्
समुदाहरत् || ४-४१-७
7. tasyaam dishi = in that, direction
of compass; su dur gamaaH = verily,
impossible, to pass – highly
impassable; ye ke cana = which of
those few; sam ut deshaaH = well,
intended, countries – some countries
that need be explained; about them;
saH kapi iishaH = he that, monkeys,
king of – Sugreeva; teSaam kapi
mukhyaanaam = to them, monkey,
prominent ones; sam udaaharat =
well, illustrated – gave a picture of.
The king of monkeys Sugreeva gave a
picture about some of the highly
impassable countries available in
southern quarter that need an
introduction to those prominent
monkeys bound south. [4-41-7]

सहस्र शिरसम् विंध्यम् नाना द्रुम
लता आयुतम् |
नर्मदाम् च नदीम् रम्याम् महोरग
निषेविताम् || ४-४१-८
ततो गोदावरीम् रम्याम् कृष्णावेणीम्
महानदीम् |
वरदाम् च महाभागाम् महोरग
निषेविताम् |
मेखलान् उत्कलाम् चैव दशार्ण
नगराणि अपि || ४-४१-९
अब्रवंतीम् अवंतीम् च सर्वम् एव अनुपश्यत
|
विदर्भान् ऋष्टिकान् चैव रम्यान्
माहिषकान् अपि || ४-४१-१०
8. sahasra shirasam = thousands, of
heads [crests]; naanaa druma lataa
aayutam = numerous, trees,
climbers, abounding in; vindhyam =
Vindhya Range; mahaa uraga ni
Sevitaam = great, snakes, adored by;
ramyaam narmadaam nadiim ca =
delightful one, Narmada, river, also;
tataH = then; ramyaam godaavariim
= wonderful one, River Godavari;
mahaanadiim = River Mahaanadi;
kR^iSNaaveNiim = River Krishnaveni,
or Krishna; mahaa bhaagaam =
highly, auspicious one; mahaa uraga
niSevitaam = by great, snakes,
adored by; varadaam ca = River
Varada, also; mekhalaan utkalaam
caiva = Mekhala, Utkala [in
territories,] also thus; dashaarNa
nagaraaNi api = Dashaarna, in cities,
also; abravantiim avantiim ca =
Abravanti, Avanti, also; vidarbhaan
R^iSTikaan caiva = Vidarbha,
Rishtika, also, thus; ramyaan
maahiSakaan api = charming
[kingdom,] in Maheeshaka, even;
sarvam eva anu pashyata = all
[everywhere,] thus, closely, see –
search thoroughly.
“Search the thousand crested
Vindhya mountains abounding with
numerous tress and climbers, then
the delightful Narmada river
coursing a little southerly to that
range, which is adored by great
snakes, along with wonderful River
Godavari, as well as River
Krishnaveni and Maha Nadi, and
then the greatly auspicious River
Varada which is an adoration to
great snakes. And the territories of
Mekhala, Utkala, the cities of
Dashaarna, kingdoms of Abravanti,
Avanti, and Vidarbha, also thus the
charming kingdom of Maheehaka, are
to be searched thoroughly. [4-41-10] Valmiki Ramayana Valmiki Ramayana – Kishkindha Kanda – Sarga 41

We have references to a Tamil King Perunchotru Udiyan Cheralaathan performing Tharpana for the dead in the Mahabharata War in Chera Kingdom.

He also provided food for both Kaurva and Pandava Armies during the Mahabharata war.

Vedas mention the spices , Peacocks, Special sandalwood.elephants being imported from the South.

During Draupadi Swayamvara Tamil Kings were present.

Tamil Kingas attended Rama and Sita Marriage at Mithila.

The vanaras were in Kishkinta pre dating Rama and were Shiva worshipers.

Hanuman is one and is considered to be an Amsa of Shiva, some say He is an Avatar of Shiva.

Considering all these facts and admitting these facts provided by the Vedas,Puranas,Ramayana and Mahabharata, it is quite probable that he Sanatana Dharma was in place much before what is found in the North.

Please refer my posts on Shiva’s Marriage date. Agastya Date, Ramayana Mahabharata Dates,Ram’s ancestor Satavrata Manu being a Dravida,Thiruvannamalai Billion Year Old and many more.

Inputs welcome.

Citation.

http://historum.com/asian-history/63682-rama-king-cholar-solar-dynasty-9.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manu_(Hinduism)#Lifespan

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daksha

The references in Sanskrit on Tamil are numerous.

I have quoted only a few.

Tamil references on Sanana Dharma, Vedas, Ramayana and Mahabharata are much more.

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I would call it criminal to assign Religion,Region, Caste, and language to Siddhas and Yogis.

This is exactly what has happened in india regarding Siddhars.

We have Tamil Siddhars,North indian Siddhas,Maha Purusha, Yogins of North India,Yogis of South india,Islamic Siddhars et al.

Siddas are Realized Souls, who transcend Time and Space.

They have no religion , caste , creed and do not belong to any one specifically but to Humanity.

This business of categorising them was stated by the Britishers as a part of dismantling Hinduism.

I have a few Posts on this issue.

The Missionaries in their effort to demolish Sanatana Dharam assumed Indian/Hindu Identities beginning with Robert De Nobili in Tamil Nadu.

They infiltrated into Hinduism under the garb of embracing it,learnt the local languages and Sanskrit , misinterpreted,misinformed, created forgeries of Hindu Literature ,apart from producing Christian literature modled afer Hindu Texts.

Thus they call the Bible as Vedaagamam. have even Jesus Sahasra nama!

These interpolations have resulted in the pollution of Indian Texts.

They have not spared even the Vedas, with Max Mueller leading the pack

Please check out my Post on Max Muller the Fraud’s quotes.

As it is Sanatana Dharma Texts do not have a written tradition.

They are transmitted orally.

So when some one embraces your Religion, pretend respect for it and prepares a written of these texts, people tend to take it as the Truth.

This is what happened to Hinduism and specifically to the Treasures of Siddhas.

Even to-day a Siddha  is considered by many as charlatans!

How does one correct this?

By producing the original records from the Oral Tradition.

I am trying to do this.

Charurasi Siddhas.

I must admit I have posted a few articles on Tamil Siddhars,North Indian Siddhas List ,guilty of the accusation I am making of these interpolators.

I have given these titles because people would read and understand only these terms as they have been fed on this.

Now to the Truth.

A Siddha is one who has transcended Citta.

Chitta is higher than Intellect.

Activity of he Brain in Mind.

Direction of the Mind is by the Intellect.

Chitta is on a Higher plane than Intellect, Buddhi.

Please refer my Posts on Yoga Sutras.

Patanjali defines Yoga as the cessation of the modifications of Chitta,

Yogaha, Chitta Vrutti Nirodhah.

Sidhhars are people who have transcended the Chitta and as such are were caled Chittas.

Also there are eight special powers come on the way to Self Realization.

They are Eight in number, called Ashtama Siddhis.

Please refer my post for more details.

The Siddhas, having realized the self , have transcended even these Siddhis.

That is also a reason why they are called Siddas.

So any realized Soul who meets this criteria is a Siddha.

How does one identify a Siddha?

I shall be posting on this shortly.

Hence there is no caste,creed,for the  Siddhas.

They are reported to be Timeless .

They can speak in any language.

For some reason they choose a particular language, Tamil, Hindi, Sanskrit and others.

That does not mean they  belong to one group.

And there is this seed sown by the west.

Some Siddhas have attained Realization by following Buddhism, especially Mahayana.

So they are shown as a distinct group.

This is incorrect.

A Siddha is a Siddha whether he followed Hinduism or Buddhism.

Please read my Posts on Siddhas, Siddhas of North India Guru Parampara,Bhogar to get a complete picture of Indian Siddhas

‘

Abhayadatta Sri is an Indian scholar of the 12th century who is attributed with recording the hagiographies of the eighty-four siddha in a text known as The History of the Eighty-four Mahasiddha (Sanskrit: Caturasitisiddha pravrtti; Wylie: grub thob brgyad bcu tsa bzhi’i lo rgyus).

Dowman holds that the eighty-four Mahasiddha are spiritual archetypes:

The number eighty-four is a “whole” or “perfect” number. Thus the eighty-four siddhas can be seen as archetypes representing the thousands of exemplars and adepts of the tantric way. The siddhas were remarkable for the diversity of their family backgrounds and the dissimilarity of their social roles. They were found in every reach of the social structure: kings and ministers, priests and yogins, poets and musicians, craftsmen and farmers, housewives and whores.^[2]

Reynolds (2007) states that the mahasiddha tradition “evolved in North India in the early Medieval Period (3–13 cen. CE). Philosophically this movement was based on the insights revealed in the Mahayana Sutras and as systematized in the Madhyamaka and Chittamatrin schools of philosophy, but the methods of meditation and practice were radically different than anything seen in the monasteries.^[3] He proffers that the mahasiddha tradition “broke with the conventions of Buddhist monastic life of the time, and abandoning the monastery they practiced in the caves, the forests, and the country villages of Northern India. In complete contrast to the settled monastic establishment of their day, which concentrated the Buddhist intelligenzia [sic.] in a limited number of large monastic universities, they adopted the life-style of itinerant mendicants, much as the wandering Sadhus of modern India.”^[3]

The charnel ground conveys how great mahasiddhas in the Nath and Vajrayana traditions such as Tilopa (988–1069) and Gorakshanath (fl. 11th – 12th century) yoked adversity to till the soil of the path and accomplish the fruit, the “ground” (Sanskrit: āśraya; Wylie: gzhi) of realization:^[4]

The charnel ground is not merely the hermitage; it can also be discovered or revealed in completely terrifying mundane environments where practitioners find themselves desperate and depressed, where conventional worldly aspirations have become devastated by grim reality. This is demonstrated in the sacred biographies of the great siddhas of the Vajrayāna tradition. Tilopa attained realization as a grinder of sesame seeds and a procurer for a prominent prostitute. Sarvabhakṣa was an extremely obese glutton, Gorakṣa was a cowherd in remote climes, Taṅtepa was addicted to gambling, and Kumbharipa was a destitute potter. These circumstances were charnel grounds because they were despised in Indian society and the siddhas were viewed as failures, marginal and defiled.

…..

The Caturasiti-siddha-pravrtti (CSP), “The Lives of the Eighty-four Siddhas”, compiled by Abhayadatta Sri, a Northern Indian Sanskrit text dating from the 11th or 12th century, comes from a tradition prevalent in the ancient city-state of Campa in the modern district of Bihar. Only Tibetan translations of this Sanskrit text seem to have survived. This text was translated into Tibetan by sMon grub Shes rab and is known as the Grub thob brgyad cu rtsa bzhi’i lo rgyus or “The Legends of the Eighty-four Siddhas”. It has been suggested that Abhayadatta Sri is identical with the great Indian scholar Mahapandita Abhayakaragupta (late 11th–early 12th century), the compiler of the iconographic compendiums Vajravali, Nispannayogavali, and Jyotirmanjari.

The other major Tibetan tradition is based on the list contained in the Caturasiti-siddhabhyarthana (CSA) by Ratnakaragupta of Vajrasana, identical with Bodhgaya (Tib.: rDo rje gdan) located in Bihar, Northern India. The Tibetan translation is known as Grub thob brgyad cu rtsa bzhi’i gsol ’debs by rDo rje gdan pa. There exist several Tibetan versions of the list of mahasiddhas based on the Vajrasana text. However, these Tibetan texts differ in many cases with regard to the Tibetan transcriptions of the Indian mahasiddhas names.

By convention there are eighty-four Mahasiddhas in both Hindu and Tibetan Buddhist traditions, with some overlap between the two lists. The number is congruent with the number of siddhi or occult powers held in the Indian Religions. In Tibetan Buddhist art they are often depicted together as a matched set in works such as thangka paintings where they may be used collectively as border decorations around a central figure.

Each Mahasiddha has come to be known for certain characteristics and teachings, which facilitates their pedagogical use. One of the most beloved Mahasiddhas is Virupa, who may be taken as the patron saint of the Sakyapa sect and instituted the Lamdré (Tibetan: lam ‘bras) teachings. Virupa (alternate orthographies: Birwapa/Birupa) lived in 9th century India and was known for his great attainments.

Some of the methods and practices of the Mahasiddha were codified in Buddhist scriptures known as Tantras. Traditionally the ultimate source of these methods and practices is held to be the historical Buddha Shakyamuni, but often it is a transhistorical aspect of the Buddha or deity Vajradhara or Samantabhadra who reveals the Tantra in question directly to the Mahasiddha in a vision or whilst they dream or are in a trance. This form of the deity is known as a sambhogakaya manifestation. The sadhana of Dream Yoga as practiced in Dzogchen traditions such as the Kham, entered the Himalayan tantric tradition from the Mahasiddha, Ngagpa and Bonpo. Dream Yoga or “Milam” (T:rmi-lam; S:svapnadarśana), is one of the Six Yogas of Naropa.^{[citation needed]}

Four of the eighty-four Mahasiddhas are women.^[9] They are:

• Manibhadra, the Perfect Wife
• Lakshmincara, The Princess of Crazy wisdom
• Mekhala, the elder of the 2 Headless Sisters
• Kanakhala, the younger of the 2 Headless Sisters.

Citations.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahasiddha#Genealogy_and_historical_dates

http://yogindr.blogspot.in/2014/03/chaurasi-siddhas.html

Please read a scholarly article on Siddhas being misinterpreted at the Link given below.

http://www.hinduwebsite.com/hinduism/essays/siddhas.asp

Related articles

https://ramanan50.wordpress.com/2014/05/30/sages-of-india-list-a-timeline/

For more on Siddhas Google Siddhas ramanan50

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